Balu (2009) Mumbai Lessons

7/27/2019 Balu (2009) Mumbai Lessons

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25/01/2013 Daily Kos: Balagangadhara: The Terror ist Multinational Business Model

www.dailykos.com/story/2008/11/30/667930/-Balagangadhara-The-Terrorist-Multinational-Business-Model 3/8

This process seems unstoppable as long as the would be terrorists can

exchange information free ly.

The only thing I can think is that what has to be addressed is the root causes

that drive young people to become suicidal terrorists.

Dailykos.com; an oasis of truth. Truth that leads to action -1.75 -7.23

by Shockwave on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 07:07:02 PM PST

* [new] Hiranyagarbha, your diaries are thought provoking

It would be nice if you participated in the comment threads.



[ Parent ]

* [new] Time problems

It is not always easy to participate. But I will try.

by Hiranyagarbha on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 08:05:56 PM PST

[ Parent ]

* [new] DailyKos works 7x24x365

Welcome!

Where is your ashram?



[ Parent ]

* [new] There is no feature...

on Kos to reply privately to personal que ries, it seems. Not that I mind so

much, but it might be use ful on occasion.


[ Parent ]

* [new] Silly of me!

Gateway to the Himalayas. Nice.



[ Parent ]

* [new] Private Responses

Many people include personal email addresses in their user profiles.

Click on their names to see if they do.

Solar is civil defense. Video of my small scale solar experiments at

solarray.

by gmoke on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 09:13:12 PM PST

[ Parent ]

* [new] To be honest...

I don't know tha t much about it. I just found this take a little different from

most of what has been said so far about this event.

What really hit me was his observation on the profess ionalism of this strike

compared to the previous "ineffectual" bombings in various places over thepast few months. You could say that the city boys had come in to show the

country bumpkins how it was done.


[ Parent ]

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4/8



* [new] Identifying these so-called terrorist CEO's

and determining if they really have such multinational CEO capabilities a nd

asp irations seems utterly critical to the hypothesis that this was merely a

training lesson. As you say, at the moment, no one has been even firmly

identified, so it strikes me as a hypothetical leap.

We don't have time for short-term thinking.

by Compound F on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 07:10:53 PM PST

* [new] Multinational meta-organisms without CEO's are...

...possible.

What comes to mind first are the communist (Red Army Faction, Red Brigade s,

Montoneros, Tupamaros)and nationalistic (IRA)urban guerrilla organizations

that seemed to use similar methods and did exchange information and

resources in Europe and La tin America during the 70s.

Now the Internet facilitates this ad-hoc type organization something similar to

what Alvin Toffler suggested in Future Shock.

Adhocracy vs. traditional hierarchical bureaucracy.



[ Parent ]

* [new] see snack related mishap's comment

below. great video.



[ Parent ]

* [new] Cooperation among intelligence....

agencies is paramount. As is mentioned above, the socio-economic

pathologies that foster bombing by suicide a re integral in minimizing these

attacks.

by appletree on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 07:12:07 PM PST

* [new] Unfortunately, you may be right

This is yet another bit of fallout from multinational corporate crime creating

enemies, the power of the internet, and the evolution of criminal enterprises.

Put them all together and you get the sort of organized criminal/terrorist

movements that writers of pulp novels have been talking about for decades.

Which, of course, w ill lead observers to no t take them seriously and to

denounce them as tinfoil-hat nonsense.

Won't it be nice to have a SMART President?

by ibonewits on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 07:20:34 PM PST

* [new] All this was predicted by many SF writers

Perhaps the Pentagon should require more Science Fiction reading.



[ Parent ]

* [new] Looking at a couple of Scots

writers--Charles Stross and Ken MacLeod--is enlightening in this context.

byjoycemocha on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 07:29:00 PM PST

[ Parent ]

* [new] I've said since 9-11

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that 40 years of reading sf had prepared me far better than the average

American for the 21s t century.

This s ig line is in foreclosure. For details on acquiring a credit default swap on this

sig line, contact H. Paulson, Dept of the Treasury, c/o Goldman, Sachs

by ActivistGuy on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 07:47:37 PM PST

[ Parent ]

* [new] (Not so) oddly ...

... I was about to go into a rif about sci-fi predictions coming true, and de cided

it would make my comment too long.

GMTA indeed!

PS: It would also be interes ting to revisit Toffler's Third Wave theories a nd

apply them to terrorism and other criminal enterprises. I've already learned

that his ideas work for other areas of human culture than the ones he paid

conscious attention to (such as re ligion).

Won't it be nice to have a SMART President?

by ibonewits on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 08:21:56 PM PST

[ Parent ]

* [new] Loretta Napoleoni: Terror Inc.

Loretta Napoleoni is an Italian economist who wrote a book about the

'economics of terrorism'. I found this video on Youtube and I'm posting it here

because I think she sheds much light on the structure and day-to-day

operations of terrorist groups.

In particular, the notion that terrorist groups are somehow like multinational

corporations s trikes me as fanciful. If anything, terrorism seems to be more

cartelized than globalized.

by snack related mishap on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 07:22:34 PM PST

* [new] interesting.

globalization sowing the dragon's teeth of its own destruction.



[ Parent ]

* [new] In a sense...

But I don't think it's spontaneously generated in the sense that we a re often

led to believe. International terrorism doesn't emerge from poverty, misery,

inequality, and similar afflictions in the s ame way that a localized resistancecell would. Internationa l terrorism may feed on these conditions, of course, but

it is my belief that it is a mistake to see these as a root caus e.

What isn't talked about much in Napoleoni's lecture or this article is the role of

national intelligence agencies in propping up these ne tworks, be it for profit or

for political reasons . Al Qaeda could not exist without the assistance of the ISI

and the CIA, who first formed the Mujihedeen a rmy in Afghanistan.

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[ Parent ]

* [new] actually, she argues that although they initially

are funded by states, they then branch out independently using similar

methods of funding, creating their own "she ll state " (her words), and

destroying the so-called legitimate former economies, as w ith the Taliban using

opium to fund their "state" that now surrounds the Mayor of Kabul. Then their

funding piggybacks transnationally on the globalized banking system.



[ Parent ]

* [new] Yes.

I was arguing that it's not clear to what extent such organizations could

exist without that initial support and protection. I was not suggesting

terrorist groups a re incapable o f cutting the umbilical cord.

On a related note, the Mayor of Kabul's brother is alleged to be one of the

biggest opium lords in Afghanistan.


[ Parent ]

* [new] Somalia as an example

From Gerald Posner, on the Somali Pirates:

Whistleblower has learned that a classified internal report at the

US Treasurys Financial Crimes Enforcement Network (FinCEN) has

concluded that the pirates are funded by expatriate Somalis and

Emiratis based in Dubai. This de termination is based, in part, on an

independent Interpol probe that managed to identify several

moneymen be hind the high sea piracy. All live in Dubai.

The businessmen backing the pirates arrange for the complex

multibank transfer of ransom funds, disbursing the money through

dozens of institutions around the globe within hours. They take a

hefty cut before sending the pirates share through hawala, an

underground cash-based Islamic banking system that leaves

behind no written or electronic records that investigators can

follow.

Here again, the story we're told is that pirates are a phenomenon that

emerges from Somalia's poverty. To an extent this is true, and Somalia is a

good example of a 'state shell', without a coast guard worth speaking of.

But these weren't just pirates; they were financed by people for profit. We

don't know if the financiers were intelligence groups with an agenda, or just

bankers seeking a profit. Neither would surprise me.


[ Parent ]

* [new] Rogue Economics

Napoleoni has also w ritten Rogue Economics which argues that much of the

international economic system is basically illegal and knows it. I have

extensive notes from the book and hope to write a diary on it soon.

Napoleoni is very good at what she does and Rogue Economics fits in with

Shock Doctrine very well.

Solar is civil defense. Video of my small scale solar experiments atsolarray.


[ Parent ]

* [new] If you look around on the right places

on the Net, you'll find that others are already thinking that this attack was

meant to divert from something that happened during the attack. Think about

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who was killed, the connections they may have had, and so on.

There's at least two sources who point to the s imilarity of this attack with the

one outlined in the novel The Dogs of Warby Frederick Forsyth. It's an

interesting thought.

byjoycemocha on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 07:28:15 PM PST

* [new] Terrorism vs. Gangsterism

There's been some talk about a Mumbai crime boss with ties to the ISI named

Dawood Ibrahim having been involved in this and other bombings. If this is

the case, then the attacks more likely had to do with territory and power than

some senseless act committed by religious or sectarian zea lotry.


[ Parent ]

* [new] "The Threat from Internat. Crime & Terrorism"

was the topic of1997 Congressional Hearings: Intelligence and Security.

The report on the hearings on "The Threat from International Organized Crime

and Global Terrorism" has a lot o f information that IMHO is worth reading.

There are 78 pages in the report, and this is just a small snip from the

Introduction:

"...We truly wish it were tha t simple. Regrettably, we are in something

far worse. I will humbly suggest that what we are w itnessing these

days a re three types of criminal activities: Drugs, terrorism, and

organized crime, which are like three huge geological plates which are

slowly starting to shift and grind together. They could ultimately

produce an earthquake of unprecedented magnitude and destruction.

"...To be specific, all of these groups are far more sophisticated, far

better financed and more disciplined than previously suspected..."

What a ll of this tells us is that in the interest of globa l business, these

dangerous groups w ill soon cross a threshold of

compartmentalization, w ill begin merging and are working jointly with

one another.

"...Its sophisticated and highly disciplined managers view crime as an

investment; indeed, an export commodity. When opportune, they will

pool resources and move back and forth between legitimate and

illegitimate activities..."

It's been 11 years since this Congressional Hearing, and I wonder how many

of the warnings were ignored, and how many of the recommendations were

implemented and kept in place through the Bush Administration.

by kurious on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 07:36:11 PM PST

* [new] Conceptually interesting

However, I believe you're putting the cart a bit before the horse . Let's let the

investigative process p lay out a bit more before we s tart trying to fit these, asyou point out very unique, attacks into some larger theory.




* [new] The investigative process is very opaque

What we'll be fed w ill be distorted by all sorts of hidden agendas and

interests.

Thought experiments suppo rted by few but ironclad facts may be the only

thing we have to work with.



[ Parent ]

* [new] You do have a point there

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8/8



.

Still right now all there is is speculation. In an event this big, some facts will

spill out into the public domain, by accident, or by the ope ration of one o f the

conflicting interests. Which is more than we have now.




[ Parent ]

* [new] Global terrorism was a threat in the 70s and 80s

with hijacked planes and ships, but now it has g raduated to a new level....an

extra-national level.

I remember read ing a book about terrorism reaching a new g lobal level in the

90s....the author was ten years off. She predicted that the new terrorism

wou ld reach a level unimaginable to the world at that time...and yes...it seems

to be a corporation.

by Temmoku on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 08:13:35 PM PST

* [new] "Terrorism" is a convenient construct

"Terrorism" is a convenient construct, enabling nation state s to hide the

effects of state sponsored violence on their own subject peoples. Seen in this

context, "terrorism" is merely a response , and usua lly an ineffectual one at

that.

In India, the terror that the state visits on its peoples in Kashmir and

elsewhere, is at least an order of magnitude more murderous (50,000+ dead

in the past two decades in Kashmir alone) and brutally effective in subverting

the possibility of any meaningful change.

by WAlib on Sun Nov 30, 2008 at 09:05:34 PM PST

* [new] Global Guerrillas

John Robb has some ideas at http://globalguerrillas.typepad.com/...

Solar is civil defense. Video of my small scale solar experiments atsolarray.


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Balu (2009) Mumbai Lessons