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Why are Soviet mathematics/physics

textbooks so insanely hardcore in

comparison to US textbooks?

One extra point (in general I agree with Alex Sergeev). I studied both in Russia and Israel

(Technion - Israel analog of IT - A!AI" Israel high education s#ste$ is $uch closer to

%SA& $an# professors wor'ed at so$e ti$e in their careers in leading %SA universities&$an# students do their docs postdocs in %SA etc). hile textboo's generall# spea'ing

were better and *easier*& and courses $aterials were presented slower in Israel& teaching

capabilities of professors and teaching assistants were $uch better in Russia.In + #ears in Technion I had , brilliant lector& handful were good& $ost were $ediocre or

 ust ver# bad (fro$ the teaching point of view - the# were ver# good as scientists& published$an# new stuff& $ost were rather pleasant to deal with as $en& etc). e had video librar#

where in case of bad luc' bad lector we could watch prerecorded lectures done in the past b# the *better* professor.

In Russia I had a couple of rather bad (for auxiliar# stuff& that I couldnt understand wh# we

had to stud# an#wa#) professors& rest were brilliant or ver# good. uch better than inIsrael. !or $ost courses our professors were also our teaching assistants (it was unusual

even in our universit#& but I studied the $ost *scientific-li'e* field in engineering universit#

- electroph#sics - so apparentl# the# wanted to give us so$e boost). I assu$e theirscientific level was $uch worse than in Israel& we al$ost had no co$puters& our

laboratories were outfitted with technolog# that was obsolete in the est (but allowed us to

learn our future profession).e studied using those *hardcore* boo's& but we got ver# well prepared lectures& fro$ professors that 'new how to explain and cared #ou understood the$. Still& fro$ a group of

around /0 persons& in the first #ear onl# / got *A* on $aths& around half got *barel# 1*& +

got *2& rest dropped (apparentl# $oved to another universit# or facult#).

a# be not related& but still - on differential e3uations ($ust-to-do course for aths& 1S

and probabl# others in Technion) there were several lectures in parallel - due to largenu$ber of students in the course.

Al$ost all who could fit in the roo$ tried to participate in the lecture of so$e old (405)

gu#& new i$$igrant fro$ Russia& who barel# spo'e 6ebrew (for $e it was hard to

understand hi$ because $# 6ebrew wasnt best at that ti$e as well). h# 7 6e was prepared for ever# lecture& he wrote the $aterial for hi$self (in 6ebrew) in Russian letters&

he was read# to answer an# 3uestion (*hat is the solution of this e3uation& and how it is

different fro$ the one #ou explained in last lecture*)& and #ou could practicall# see how hetranslated for hi$self the 3uestion to Russian& got a solution and explanation i$$ediatel#&

then slowl# translated it to 6ebrew and with thic' accent explained it to the student. 6e

was read# to solve an#thing that #ou throw at hi$& and usuall# using several differenttechni3ues& de$onstrating when it is better to use which one.

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Our $ain lecturer& Israeli professor& when as'ed to solve so$ething that wasnt directl#

fro$ last ho$ewor' 3uestion& answered *I do not advance the science near the whiteboard&go as' TA in reception hours*.

 

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:ladi$ir <ova'ovs'i& %S I=hO tea$ /00,

>>./' :iews 9 %pvoted b# Sa$ Sinai& =h.; student in athe$atical 2iolog#:ladi$ir  has ,005 answers in athe$atics.

Its not ust $ath and ph#sics -- the education s#ste$ in the %SSR was li'e that in general.

In other areas li'e literature& chess& figure s'ating& ballet& etc.& there was the sa$e pattern of$a'ing sure the top students are challenged and can grow into leaders while $a'ing the

course prett# $uch inaccessible for ever#one else.

2# contrast& in the %S s#ste$& ever#one gets so$ething out of the course& but the topstudents $a# need to rel# on activities outside of school if the# want to develop their

talents.

I thin' that the Soviet s#ste$ $a'es sense if #ou $a'e the assu$ption that ever#one has

one particular talent and as long as the education s#ste$ covers enough areas that #our

strengths will shine so$ewhere& then #ou will develop into a leader in that area. This isconsistent with the overall approach of the govern$ent $atching people to careers and

having little option for tr#ing so$ething different later in life. ?etting a reasonable general

education& giving #ou the optionalit# to experi$ent with careers later on& is $ore consistentwith A$erican values. 

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Alex Sergeev& =h; in =h#sics

/>0.@' :iews 9 %pvoted b# Sa$ Sinai& =h.; student in athe$atical 2iolog#Alex has ,005 answers in =h#sics.

As I understand fro$ reading co$$ents& the O= $eans not school textboo's& but universit#

textboo's& in particular andau-ifshitB was $entioned. In such case& I have to disagreewith $ost answers presented.

!irstl#& #es& the# are indeed noticeabl# $ore hardcore than courses of a si$ilar level in the%S. Cnough to co$pare two classic coursesD andau-ifshitB and !e#n$an ectures

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(which are& in turn& not reall# a wal' in a par' either& there are plent# of friendlier boo's).

Sa$e can be said about $athe$atical anal#sis boo's which I encountered. Soviet textboo's ust go straight to the point and throw lots of definitions and for$ulas at #ou& without an#

 preparation. The %S textboo's tr# to explain si$ple things in $ore detail& and increase the

co$plexit# as the# progress.

The reason for it& I thin'& is the difference in education s#ste$s. In the %S& the point of

education s#ste$ is to teach students& as well as possible. In the %SSR& the point was to get

rid of wea'er students and have onl# ver# good ones left& who would understand the subectno $atter how hardcore the approach to it is. It $ight be $ore ps#chological rather than

intentional& but in Soviet ti$es it was a general senti$entD if #ou cant do it straight-awa#&

#ou are si$pl# not good enough and should do so$ething else. The %S s#ste$ tries toi$prove students and then select the best& the Soviet s#ste$ tried to select the best and then

i$prove the$. The %S s#ste$ tries to $a'e geniuses out of average students& the Soviet

s#ste$ tried to select geniuses disregarding average students. I $ight be a bit too

categorical with this& but I dont thin' it is too far fro$ truth.

Another possible reason& ste$$ing fro$ the above is a lac' of co$petition. In the %S& the

education s#ste$ is adapting to students need& if the boo's are not teaching good enoughthe# get replaced or a$ended. In the %SSR& the textboo's were centrall# selected and

approved& and students had to adapt to whatever the# were given.

CditD I also have ust recalled this phrase ver# widel# circulated during Soviet ti$esD *e

dont have irreplaceable people*. (It actuall# originated $uch earlier& and was used b#

oodrow ilson& but is widel# assigned to Stalin& who in fact never said an#thing li'e that.I also believe that the connotation was intended to be different.) This phrase& however& well

de$onstrates the ps#cholog# of Soviet s#ste$. <o one cared if #ou fail& therell be another

 person whod ta'e #our place. In the %S& if student is struggling& it is partiall# a teachers

faultE in the %SSR& it is ,00F students fault. 

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ar' 2ri$son& =roect anager& interested in learning new things

,@.H' :iews 9 %pvoted b# ;avid 8o#ce& =rofessor of athe$atics at 1lar' %niversit#

It is not ust Soviet boo's. I find it the case with $an# other Curopean countries. <ow& Idont have data so this is purel# Janecdotal evidenceK. Cver#one I 'now who ca$e fro$

Curope to stud# in %S in pri$ar# and secondar# school was a$aBed how eas#

$athe$atics& ph#sics and che$istr# was. It is not strange that #ou have average studentfro$ Russia who is acing all tests. As so$eone alread# $entioned& stud#ing in $an#

Curopean countries is <OT $eant to be fun. It is $eant to be hard and boring. Scientific

facts are in $an# Curopean countries (especiall# ex-1o$$unist countries) presented in the$ost boring and raw wa#& without progressive elaboration and sche$es with colors.

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See exa$ple of the ph#sics textboo' I used in $# secondar# school (,4 #ears old). hen

#ou open it there are ust for$ulas. =eople who are professors in $an# ex-co$$unistcountries are barel# surviving. Salaries are ridiculousl# low. So the onl# reason wh# the#

are JbotheringK with science is their i$$ense love and passion. hat 'ind of reasoning

#ou can expect fro$ this people7 It goes so$ething li'e thisD Jath is hard and #ou are

either cut out to understand it or #ou better find so$ething else. Also& we onl# needfor$ulas on the old rec#cled paper and students will (have to) understand itK

In %SA the# constantl# tr# to twea' the s#ste$ to $a'e it Juser-friendl#K and the# honestl#

 believe in practical 'nowledge and that ever#one can understand al$ost an#thing if #outeach the$. Also& education is billion dollar business in %SA.

 

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StLphane TouBL 9 Re3uest 2io

/.G' :iewsThe soviet s#ste$ for teaching $athe$aticsph#sicsengineering (which I dont 'now

about) see$s to be 3uite si$ilar to the !rench s#ste$ (which I do 'now about) in tworespects D

- on practical ter$s& it atte$pts at selectingran'ing students based on raw $athe$atical

abilit# E

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- in ter$s of pedagog#& it ai$s at giving students a :CRM rigorous $athe$atical

fra$ewor'& which is then applied extensivel# in engineering courses. As a result&engineering courses in !R%SSR are usuall# $uch $ore for$al in ter$s of $athe$atics

co$pared to the %S.

Seriousl#& if #ou co$pare engineering courses in the %S vs. !R%SSR& #oull li'el# noticethat that the content is ver# si$ilar but the $athe$atical *pac'aging* is $ore intense in

!R%SSR.

These are ust two different approaches in ter$s of pedagog#& and both have their own

$erit.

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Anna Shustrova 9 Re3uest 2io,,4.4' :iews 9 %pvoted b# Anurag 2ishnoi& =h.;. student in athe$atics at ?hent

%niversit#.

Though I was born later I had a lot of old teachers who were trained in %SSR so Ill tr# toanswer. All these soviet teachers have one co$$on featureD the# appreciate deep

understanding $uch $ore than an#thing else. Mou will never i$press the$ b# $e$oriBing

long for$ulas but the# will be happ# if #ou derive the$ fro$ si$ple well-'nown. The# believe that science is $ore than facts and patterns. Cver#thing should be explained and

 proved. Mou should understand how one fact follows fro$ another and (ideall#) #ou should

 be able to continue. It helps to see the whole picture and to find the shortest wa#s to solve proble$s. Soviet textboo's wor' on the sa$e principles. 

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Anton a'harov& Software Cngineer 

,0.4' :iews6aving been born and have studied @ #ears in soviet education s#ste$& i would sa# the

education of all levels was $ore de$anding. ain reason is $ostl# because parents valued

education alot& and thus spend great deal of ti$e with their 'ids helping the$ to learn. ealso had $uch $ore ho$ewor' to do.

As for $athe$atics& teaching was $erciless. If #ou wanted to pass #ou needed tounderstand. Once #ou understand& ever# #ear #ou si$pl# add to #our 'nowledge& instead of 

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relearning and re-$e$oriBing it ever# #ear. Thus while the boo' see$s hard to an outsider&

to $e (and probabl# $ost Russians who had their education s#ste$)& the# see$ed ustnor$al.

 

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i'e ian& I have a librar# card - old school.

H' :iewsI thin' Alex Sergeev discussion about the philosoph# is closest to the $ar'. In the %S

education is a business while in %SSR education is a social service.

This $eans %S universities ai$ to $axi$iBe revenue through $anage$ent of their brand

value (t#picall# $easured as selectivit# - what percentage of students the# can reect andstill fill the ca$pus) and student satisfactionexpectation. These are t#picall# opposing

forces as students ran' staff based on grades the# receive.

In Russia the goal of the education s#ste$ is to find the $ost capable and filter down the

student bod# reducing the cost. Cducators present the re3uired course $aterial highlightingan# nuanced subtleties that could trip up the infor$ed and the# are not ran'ed b# the

student bod# but b# their peers& so brevit# tends to be preferred.

I have a Russian friend who taught $aths at a %S universit# and was flu$$oxed when she

was repri$anded b# the depart$ent head when students co$plained she graded too hard.

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Anon#$ous

/.G' :iews

I thin' $a#be #oure referring to the texts that were used at oscow State %niversit# toteach students in the echanics and athe$atics depart$ent for instance. These people

were the absolute best students in the %SSR(barring that whole discri$ination against 8ews

fiasco).

 an# of the$ are now tenured professors at $ost of the $aor research universities in the

%S or Curope. hen #our standard is to teach to future professors& #ou go for these boo's because the# will prepare students to beco$e researchers. !ew universities in the %S are

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training their undergrads with hopes of beco$ing professors. 6ence& the# have no need for

speciall# challenging classes or textboo's.

There are a few that do& and so$e are notable for $a'ing their $ath depart$ent entirel#

for people who want to go on to a pre$ier pure $ath =h; progra$ i$$ediatel# after& Ill

$ention a few of theseD 6arvard& =rinceton& 1hicago. If beco$ing a $ath professor is #ourgoal then #ou want to attend these places generall# spea'ing. If #ou co$pare their options

for their students& then #oull see that the# dont differ $uch fro$ what is found in these

Soviet series of boo's. 

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2oris 1huprin 9 Re3uest 2io/./' :iews

Answer is si$pleD In %S& higher education is a business& in %SSR it is a privilege.In %SSR education was free& and if #ou studied reasonabl# well #ou could also get a

stipend so #ou didnt even have to wor' until #ou get #our diplo$a. Mou could also avoid or 

 postpone $andator# $ilitar# service.So& the co$petition was high and the teaching $aterials ust reflected that.

h# would govern$ent pa# for #our education if #ou are not capable enough and there are

doBens waiting to ta'e #our place7In %S& the# dont reall# want #ou to 3uit& because #ou pa# for #our education.

Theres another reason. Soviet theoretical ph#sics school is sort of uni3ue. andau was a

savant& a perfectionist and eventuall# shaped the whole co$$unit# after hi$self. And onl#the brightest were allowed to oin.Those ph#sicists were treated reall# well& because ato$ic bo$bs& roc'ets and radars were

in high de$and.

ith so$e other sciences the situation was $uch& $uch worse. 

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 <ir !ried$an 9 Re3uest 2io

/.N' :iewsThis 3uestion is indulging in so$e 3uestion begging& and I find it anno#ing that its not

 being challenged. Ive co$e across Russian textboo's& $ostl# in the for$ of andau and

ifschitB. There are plent# of exa$ples of textboo's where the top boo's& both inexplanation and in difficult#& are not Russian.

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8ac'son is the standard graduate electro$agnetis$ boo'. Ive heard professors o'e aboutwhether the author could solve all the proble$s. =athria is a ver# intense undergraduate stat

$ech boo'. Sa$e with Shan'har for 3uantu$. !or 3uantu$& the $ost elegant and

$athe$aticall# $otivated loo' at the funda$entals of non relativistic 3$ is perhaps given

 b# Sa'urai.

I studied ph#sics for ten #ears and I cant sa# Ive ever heard so$eone ever sa# that.

Russians rarel# have wea' $ath s'ills li'e so$e A$erican students& but that is another$atter.

 

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;$itr# Sh'olni'  9 Re3uest 2io

/.@' :iews8ust to add one econo$ic reason to what was said before...

The textboo's in Soviet %nion were heavil# subsidiBed b# state. In lot of the cases #oueven couldnt go to the store and bu# it& #ou had to get it through schooluniversit# librar#

(and return after course final exa$& otherwise #ou wouldnt be allowed to get boo's for the

next #ear).

The textboo's were printed on a poor 3ualit# thin gra# paper& and there was a push to 'eep

texts shorter ust to 'eep boo's cheaper (add here that text in Russian is approx. ,.+ longerthan its Cnglish translation). !ro$ other hand& the pa# for peoples ti$e was 3uite low& sothe# could have lecturers and TAs providing $ore exa$ples& explanation and details.

 

I re$e$ber& when I got $# first #ear set of textboo's fro$ S% librar#& there were /05 poorl# printed boo's& and one state-of-the-art printed *athe$atical Anal#sis* b#

Sadovnich# (then vice-rector& now rector of S%) and so$e 2ulgarian gu#.

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Anatoli# =latonov 9 Re3uest 2io

4.4' :iews 9 %pvoted b# ;avid 8o#ce& =rofessor of athe$atics at 1lar' %niversit#

fhe discussion is not absolutel# correct P we did not define the ter$ J$athe$aticsK. Thereare two $utuall# connected but relativel# independent $athe$aticsD the JappliedK and

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JpureK ones.

;ifference is well expressed b# popular ($a# be not onl# in Russia) o'eD J=ure

$athe$atics solves what it can as it should be& and applied $athe$atics solves what it

should as it can beK.

I.e. & the Jpure oneK develops itself& li'es axio$atic and absolute precision in derivations&and has no special interest to applications. The Japplied oneK uses $athe$atics

instru$entall#& and courageousl# applies it to the practical tas's onl# tr#ing not to $a'e

terrible $ista'es& and has no special interest to the pure $athe$atics.The representatives of both sides prefer not to spea' although definite $utual interest

exists.

Teaching the engineers in top Russian technical universities begins fro$ a good piece of

funda$ental $athe$atics with explanation and training the students P how it wor's in

applied tas's. The result of their efforts directl# depends on the attention to $athe$atics in

schools and societ#.This also deter$ines the percent of future pure $athe$aticians - the# are ver# s$all part of

 population.

=.S. This difference deter$ines the level of *readibilit#* of textboo's. 2oth pure and

applied $athe$aticians have own al$ost not overlapping libraries& and have no wish to

loo' at these of *al$ost colleagues*. The sa$e concerns the approaches to teaching thestudents.

 

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8on 6arrop& 1CO !l#ing !rog 1onsultanc#

/.>' :iewsI did ph#sics in acade$ia at the %niversit# of 1a$bridge alongside $an# people fro$ both

the %S and Russia. =eople in the %S strived to explain things in si$ple ter$s and include

 practical relevance. Al$ost ever# Russian I encountered strived to $a'e eas# things soundhard in an atte$pt to i$press people. The difference is exacerbated b# %S students being

relativel# behind in their studies during their first undergraduate degree. !or us& the

!e#n$an lectures were a pleasant wal' in the par' whereas andau and ifshitB was

extre$el# dr# and boring. 

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Muri# Suslov& I read a lot

/.>' :iews

%SSR students& li'e %S businesses& were allowed to fail. And get up again& as higher

education was free& #ou could tr# at it several ti$es& and there were several s#ste$sallowing for eas# retries - #ou could ta'e out acade$ical vacations& or retr# the whole #ear

of stud#& if #ou failed to pass the exa$s.

In topelite institutions& students were also expected (and taught how to) wor' on their own&

to& as Anna Shustrova correctl# $entions& to i$prove their deep understanding. Those

hardcore textboo's are explicitl# targeted at the deep understanding end of learning& ever#state$ent is provided with a rigorous proof in ter$s of state$ents a level below in

co$plexit# and difficult#. 2asicall#& such a text boo' covers a level of difficult# it is

s3uarel# ai$ed at& and two other levels& one right below it (b# providing so$e reference$aterial and a discussion of facts considered *basic* b# the targeted level of difficult#) and

one right above it (b# providing specificall# $ar'ed sections of advanced $aterial forstronger students). And ever# text boo' clearl# listed its difficult# level in the introduction&

so if #ou do not understand whats in the boo'& #ou reall# shouldnt read it& #ou arent #etread#& and should tr# at so$ething of a lower difficult# level. This is a lot li'e the %S

s#ste$ of $ar'ing classes& 1S ,0,& 1S /0,& 1S >0,& etc. So& due to the reliance on the

autono$ous wor' and this being the Soviet Russia& the text boo' $ade the course& not thecourse $ade the text boo'.

One $ore thing I should $ention is that students had $ost of their needs provided for b#state. The# had free housing& free stud# $aterials& cheap food& and a stipend paid out to

the$ which was enough to cover a basic lifest#le. Students basicall# were expected not to

wor'& unless this was a part of their stud# (called practice)& or a part of their scientificcarreer (well& and so$e forced labor in the agriculture). 

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1iprian Clliu Ivanof  9 Re3uest 2io

@0./' :iews 9 %pvoted b# :ladi$ir <ova'ovs'i& %S I=hO tea$ /00,The %SSR and the %S had different reasons to teach $athe$atics.

Soviet views of 1o$$unis$ as the ulti$ate technocrac# $eant that technical fields(preferable $athe$aticall# provable ones) were highl# privileged. athe$atics was a

re3uire$ent for $an# obs that didnt even involve the$ (li'e naval officers). To the %SSR&

$athe$atics was an extre$e re3uire$ent for societ# and taught with the $ercilessness of atraditional societ# sensing survival at sta'e.

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athe$atics s'ills re3uire lots of preparation and lots of support for the budding$athe$atician. The %SSR hiac'ed their entire educational s#ste$ for the (resulting in

 perhaps less serious social sciences) hard sciences. an# obs not entailing actual

$athe$atical 'nowledge be#ond derivatives were filled with $athe$atical re3uire$ents so

that there was not ust a $assive nu$ber of people tr#ing to cra$ $ath but also lots of people whose sincere $athe$atical curiosit# needed to be differentiated fro$ careerists.

hen writing textboo's for teachers who need to identif# prodigies& #ou need challenging proble$s.

The %S wanted $ore engineers but did not have the ideological need to prove things$athe$aticall# or the utter control over societ# that would $a'e $ore stringent public

$ath education possible. Since the public school s#ste$ was geared towards providing

 bab#sitting and $ini$al certifications for students before college& that conflicted with the

effort to i$prove $ath education. =rivate schools have far $ore variabilit# in the %S and$an# of the$ li'el# focused on serious teaching co$parable to their Soviet counterparts.

The %S teachers were under $ore pressure to use the textboo' and were also under $ore pressure to help least capable students instead of the $ost capable (the %SSR was the

reverse). The textboo's in the %S tend to be about the $ini$all# literate citiBen& not the

future defense engineer. 

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Saeed ;oroudiani& =ol#$er Scientist and Cngineer 

,./' :iews

Si$pl# because the education had a great priorit# in that s#ste$& so the# were allocating big budget on education& including textboo's. hile I was not living in Soviets& but in

,G40s and earl# ,GH0s #ears those textboo's and practice boo's published b# ir

=ublishers of Soviet were so helpful for $e and other students to stud# $ath (trig& algebra&calculus& Ol#$piads& etc) and ph#sics. The# were all translated ver# well in Cnglish. Those

*hardcore* boo's were available in $an# countries at ver# low price. hile the# were

affordable for $e as a high school students to bu# all of the$ fro$ $# ver# li$ited poc'et

$one#& but at that ti$e I heard that the# were available free in so$e parts of Africa andAsia.

So& the answer to the above 3uestion of *wh#*& was the huge budget behind education for

 publicE not onl# public of Soviets citiBens& but also foreign countries. Cducation had priorit# in the %SSR s#ste$& whereas cold war was forcing the$ (and estern countries as

well) to spend high percentage of their revenue for $ilitar#.

 CditD hile the $ain topic of the 3uestion is about the binding 3ualit# of text boo's not

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contents& but I read in so$e co$$ents that $ath boo's published in %SSR were hard to

stud#. # experience was entirel# opposite to this& as the boo's were so eas# to follow andgreat for self learning. As I was tutoring $ath and ph#sics when I was in high school (and

later #ears)& I needed sources that help $e to help students in trouble with $ath to

understand concepts& such as li$its& functions& and derivatives. These boo's co$ing fro$

%SSR were so helpful for $e to the ob& both to $# understanding the concepts $oredeepl# and to teach the$ to ordinar# students.

 

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8ugurtha 6adar  9 Re3uest 2io/@./' :iews

Its a $atter of perspective& Id sa#.

!ro$ $# perspective& its not %SSR boo's that are hardcore& its %S boo's that are wa# toocluttered.

6eres wh#D

ets suppose #oure in third #ear in %niversit#& and in third #ear& #ou need to 'now topic

!. To understand !& #ou studied A and 2 in #our first and second #ear. It is without sa#ingthat A and 2 were understood building on 6igh-School 'nowledge 1& ;& and C...

A %S boo' will tell #ou that #oure going to learn !. Then the authors will oblige andre$ind #ou about A& 2& 1& ;& and C. G00 pages. Mou s'ip H00 to read the /00 that $atter.2# the ti$e #ou get to the ! (ing) point& #oure tired.

A %SSR boo' will address !. /00 pages that $atter. Mou actuall# read the$.

%S boo's are li'e the *=reviousl# on ..* in T: showsD avid viewers s'ip that part as its

onl# for people who arent serious& who are disconnected fro$ the topic or with shortattention span

%SSR boo's assu$e that #ou should 'now whats prere3uisite. The assu$ption is so strong

that the# dont even QtellQ #ou about what QisQ prere3uisite 'nowledgeD if #ou dontunderstand& then #ou shouldnt have pic'ed that boo' in the first place and should wor' on

whatever #ou s'ipped in #our life thin'ing #oure a s$art aQQ.. And if #ou do have it& then

its useless to tal' about it because its a waste of paper to tal' about whats alread# 'nown.

Reall#& %S boo's are the hard ones to read. The#re li'e that friend ever#one hasD 6ell sa#

that his grand-$other received a pac'age& then bifurcate to tal' about the post$an who brought it& then describe what the post$an was wearing& then re$e$ber he has a friend

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who wor's at the co$pan# that $anufactures post$en clothes& tal' about the fire that too'

 place inside their building& then re$e$ber his friend who was a fire$an& then re$e$ber heconfused hi$ with another one and his friend wasnt a fire$an and its the other friend who

is& and the first friend is a $all cop& then go in a co$parison between $all cops and real

cops& then real cops and fire$en... And all #ou want to 'now is what the darn pac'age his

grand $other received contains.

The 'ind that would *give an Aspirin a headache*.

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8ean ;upont 9 Re3uest 2io

,' :iews!rench and russian $entalit# with respect to $aths have a lot in co$$on. 2oo's are 'nown

for being dense and hard to assi$ilate& $a'ing so$e boo's i$possible to attac' in a self-learner perspective.

This $ight be lin'ed to the structure of their educational s#ste$& based on elite public

school& as& as said Alex& the goal is to eli$inate the wea'er in order to 'eep the crea$ of thecrop.

I would si$pl# add that& in case of !rance& this creates extre$el# confor$ist students which

are ust targeting the best grade without ta'ing an# distance with respect to the topic the#are stud#ing.

At professional scale& these people& totall# disgusted b# their discipline& tend to forget their

technical bac'ground and concentrate on their career. It leads to situation when people actli'e technical $on'e#s and re$ain extre$el# confor$ist fro$ a technical perspective because the# do not have good funda$entals on their discipline.

On research perspective& onl# a few people have the cognitive and contextual facilities to

ta'e that distance& and potential innovate.I personall# too' the decision to finish $# degree abroad because I was fed up with that

$ind state.

And what I understood with #ears& is that so$ething that appears incredibl# co$plicated atfirst glance $ight see$ absolutel# natural several $onth later.

There are several la#ers of understanding in $athe$atics and ph#sics& and if #ou dont give

this ti$e to thin' activel# about so$e deep notions& #ou can not reall# understand the

underl#ing $echanics behind the scene.And fro$ ti$e to ti$e& ver# si$ple li'e balls in topolog# $a'es #ou see$ natural even

extre$el# abstract notions.

As a conclusion& I do not respect that 'ind of s#ste$. 

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!rederic' 2artlett& riter& Cditor& T#pographer& 2oo' ;esigner 

,0.4' :iews

2ac' in the $id-N0s& I was the editor of a Russian-Cnglish translation progra$ for anA$erican publisher.& $ainl# in ph#sics and $athe$atics. I got to $eet and chat with $an#

well-'nown Soviet acade$ics -- eldovich and A'hieBer were the $ost pro$inent -- and

with $an# Russian-spea'ing A$ericans.

The topic of different approaches to education ca$e up regularl#. An# 'id fro$ a top Soviet

high school would be expected to run rings around an# but the best students at the bestA$erican universities. <o one disagreed with this.

The difference ca$e in graduate school& b# which ti$e the differences in purel# technicals'ill and 'nowledge had evened out -- and there& the A$erican s#ste$ shone. A$erican

graduate schools encouraged a 'ind of i$aginative intellectual freedo$ that was extre$el#rare in the %SSR.

I confess that I dont see wh# we A$ericans cant excel at both ends of the spectru$ ....

 

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:arisa 6adarpashic& 1lasicall# trained $usician with an interest in science& astrono$#&robotics ...

4' :iews

e used to have a Soviet education s#ste$ when I was a 'id in $# countr#& and had old boo's and soviet class professors. The boo's had lengthl# but prett# straight forward

explanations& and also fro$ what $# parents have told $e& universit# level boo's on such

subects li'e $ath& ph#sics& astrono$# were reall# difficult and the# were setting astandard& that if #ou could not learn the subect& #ou shouldnt be stud#ing that field. %nli'e

now where $ost of the education s#ste$ is transfor$ed to rese$ble the %S s#ste$ and is a

 business $ore than a national service& we have education that is watered down and al$ost

an#one can get a degree on an#thing. ( $an# students& lots of $one#)To sa# I re$e$ber better what I was taught in @ th grade b# a soviet s#ste$ than what I

re$e$ber fro$ $# last #ear of universit# of a new and i$proved education s#ste$ is an

understate$ent.2# the wa# I$ fro$ a for$er Mugoslavian state& and the regi$ent was $uch the sa$e as in

soviet Russia.

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?eorge ?onBaleB& !our se$esters of =h#sics =assed all of the$/.H' :iews 9 ?eorge has ,&@+05 answers in =h#sics.

So$e %S colleges have $ath classes for $ath $aors& and $ath classes for $aors that ust

use $ath and $ath classes for soft sciences.

In the $ath class for $ath $aors the# tend to derive and prove ever#thing& fro$ scratch&

the professors are $ore than happ# to do this& and its a wonderful thing& if #ou appreciatethe $athe$atical $ethod and proofs and will so$eda# be writing #our own proofs.

In the $ath class for $aors that ust use $ath& the# s'ip over $uch $ore lightl# over proving the basics& the# either spend two $inutes on the proofs or the# sa# *ust accept

these twelve things about li$its*.

In the $ath classes for soft sciences& the# ver# lightl# go over the concepts of slopes anddifferentiation and areas under a curve and integration& but #ou can pass the class without

having to be able to integrate /x.

Ideall# #oud have ever#bod# being able to appreciate ever# nuance of proving ever# little

thing& but its perhaps $ore realistic to triage the $ath curricula this wa#.

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Maggan eeuw& edical ;octor 

N+4 :iews

Though I studied $edicine in the %SSR& $athe$atics was a subect #ou had to pass& and pass well in $edical school. =ossibl# the difficult part was $astering the Russian language&

enabling one to have a good co$$and of the subect. %SSR universit# teacher were strong

in the foundations of their sciences. ?reat attention is attached to abstract and theoretical

 understanding. Thus& #ears latter on attending a post-graduate Sc at %niversit# ofondon I found a discipline such as i$$unolog# eas# and ver# logical. So& $astering

Russian& which I still spea' and read and $edical science& helped $# understanding that

there no li$its to the hu$an $ind. 

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Anon#$ous

,' :iews

I would sa# the 3uestion should beD

Why are US mathematics/physics textbooks so insanely easy in comparison to Soviet

textbooks?

I find the Soviet textboo's at exactl# the right *hardcore* level given the subects and the

goal& that is& to reall# learn b# developing a long-ter$ deep and foundational understanding.On the other hand& $an# %S textboo's are too si$ple for subects li'e $ath and ph#sics&

and such boo's re3uire unnecessar# $e$oriBation without focusing on deep understanding

 because the# are written for the sa'e of obtaining a good grade in the short run. 

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Alexe# =is'arev& born in the %SSR 

>.H' :iewsThe 3uestion should be the contrar#D wh# %S textboo's are so feeble.

Soviet authorities believed that a #oung person should learn and 'now as $uch as he probabl# could. h# waste the ti$e when #our brain is capable of co$prehending7

Student is the one who is responsible for the future of his own& of people around hi$ and of 

the entire countr#. Thats wh# he $ust $aster $ore than ust pri$ar# calculus. 

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Rich =eBBullo 9 Re3uest 2io

,.>' :iews

6aving 'nown so$e Russian teachers who taught in the Soviet era& I need to disagree with;r. Sergeev. 6e $aintains that *<o one cared if #ou fail& therell be another person whod

ta'e #our place. In the %S& if student is struggling& it is partiall# a teachers faultE in the

%SSR& it is ,00F students fault.*

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In the %SSR& I was told& if the student failed to learn& it was the teachers failure - andfailure was not tolerated.

If it re3uired special tutoring& visits to the students ho$e& creation of additional $aterials -

it all landed on the teacher to get it done. ?etting fired as a teacher $eant being $oved to alaborers ob& and the# were highl# $otivated <OT to fail.

 

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Ian iller & Independent ph#sical scientist& author N.G' :iews

I dont understand the *insanel# hardcore*. In $# #ounger da#s& I taught $#self a lot of ph#sics fro$ Soviet textboo's& ad$ittedl# translated to Cnglish but published in oscow&

and I found the$ e$inentl# suitable& clear& and reasonabl# rigorous. hat $ore would #ouwant7

 

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Ignat Soro'o 9 Re3uest 2io,.>' :iews

It is expected that a student in Russia applies hi$herself and studies hard. In A$erica it is

unrealistic to expect that& as students *pa#ed $one#* so that professors entertain the$. Sothe textboo's are du$bed down as $uch as possible& disguising this feature as being $ore

accessible.

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A#$ane el !ardi& =h; student (athe$atical Anal#sis)@>H :iews

I agree with r Ian iller . I appreciate reading boo's fro$ the ir edition. I used the

S$irnovs *1ours de $athe$ati3ues superieure* for a long ti$e. and now for $# research I

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a$ using boo's fro$ the sa$e publishing house about special functions. I find their st#le

 brief& co$pact and rigorous. I agree that it is hart for a first reader but I thin' their st#le isgood to use it as a reference and for 3uic' returning to for$ulas.