When the next bomb goes off in London, blame the judges – Telegraph Blogs

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Blogs Home News Defence Con Coughlin

Con Coughlin

Con Coughlin is the Telegraph's Defence Editor and a world-renowned expert on global

security and terrorism issues. He is the author of several critically acclaimed books. His

new book, Khomeini's Ghost, is published by Macmillan. He appears regularly on radio

and television in Britain and America.
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When the next bomb goes off in London, blame the

judges

By Con CoughlinDefence Last updated: February 10th, 2010

144 CommentsComment on this article

Binyam Mohamed says he was tortured in Pakistan Photo: AP

Why don't our judges just come clean and sign up with the Taliban? Every time they are asked to choose between the

defence of the realm, or upholding the rights of some Islamic militant who claims his human rights have been violated, the

judges invariably find in favour of the latter. Whether it is holding suspected terrorists so that thorough investigations of

their activities can be carried out, or pandering to civil rights campaigners such as the odious Clive Stafford-Smith, the

judical establishment never misses an opportunity to undermine the government's efforts to protect us from harm.

Perhaps it's because me lerned friends are too grand to travel by public transport, but the only reason I can think of to

explain their egregious behaviour is that they somehow feel immune from the threat posed by Islamist terror groups.

Even when the security services have raised the current terror threat level to "severe", the judges are more interested in

bending over backwards to accommodate deeply unsympathetic characters like Binyam Mohamed than paying proper

attention to the nation's security needs.

Poor Binyam claims he was tortured after he was caught "back-packing" in Afghanistan. Of course no one in the

judiciary pays the slightest bit of notice when Binyam insists that he had travelled to Afghanistan simply to help out with

some charity work, rather than, as our intelligence and security services suspect, to assist the Taliban and al-Qaeda with

their plots to blow up the West. They are only interested that, once he had been safely removed from the battlefield, hishuman rights might somehow have been violated.

The document that has now been released by the Foreign Office relates that Binyam was subjected to sleep deprivation,

rather than the more lurid claims his lawyers have made about him having his testicles slashed with razors. Poor
http://http//http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/terrorism-in-the-uk/7203741/Binyam-Mohamed-torture-allegations-must-be-disclosed-day-judges.htmlhttp://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/files/2010/02/bin.jpghttp://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/concoughlin/100025663/when-the-next-bomb-goes-off-in-london-blame-the-judges/#dPostCommenthttp://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/concoughlin/100025663/when-the-next-bomb-goes-off-in-london-blame-the-judges/#disqus_threadhttp://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/category/defence/http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/author/concoughlin/


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diddums. When I travel to Afghanistan with the Army we live on three hours sleep a night, but no one complains about

sleep deprivation. We just get on with it.

But there is a serious point to today's disgraceful ruling by the High Court. Our national security depends heavily on our

intelligence-sharing cooperation with the U.S., and it is thanks to the intel provided by the CIA and other U.S.

intelligence agencies that we have managed to avoid a repeat of the July 7 bombings. But if the Americans, alarmed at

the willingness of our judges to humiliate them in public, decide to scale down the level of cooperation, our national

security will undoubtedly be placed in jeopardy.

Certainly, if another al-Qaeda bomb goes off in London, the judges will be as much to blame as Osama bin Laden.

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alegitbritcit

02/22/2010 04:30 AM

Where does this self destructive streak come from that always s eem to infectlabour governments? Weak politicians,treasonous behaviour,weak judges so out

of touch with normal s ociety,liberal lefties undermining the UK every chance itgets.Laws from here and the EU designed to undermine and weaken us,at thesam e time protect the rights of terrorists,criminals and every deviant Why doesLabour always,always,always promote the rights of minorities be itethnics,homosexuals,lesbians,muslims,illegal immigrants,phony as ylumseekers, in fact anyone except the rights of the majority the way a democracyshould work? We are at war ,torture is acceptable to obtain info to safeguard thecountry and it's citizens,that is the real world we live in not Walt Disney's.Why inGod's name are we interested in some ignorant,deluded terrorist who is not evenBritish?For God's s ake he went to Asia with the intention of killing British s oldiershe has no rights end of argument. This is why is Britain is in the mes s it is.

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alegitbritcit

02/22/2010 04:29 AM

Where does this self destructive streak come from that always s eem to infectlabour governments? Weak politicians,treasonous behaviour,weak judges so outof touch with normal s ociety,liberal lefties undermining the UK every chance itgets.Laws from here and the EU designed to undermine and weaken us,at thesam e time protect the rights of terrorists,criminals and every deviant Why doesLabour always,always,always promote the rights of minorities be itethnics,homosexuals,lesbians,muslims,illegal immigrants,phony as ylumseekers, in fact anyone except the rights of the majority the way a democracy

should work? We are at war ,torture is acceptable to obtain info to safeguard thecountry and it's citizens,that is the real world we live in not Walt Disney's.Why inGod's name are we interested in some ignorant,deluded terrorist who is not evenBritish?For God's s ake he went to Asia with the intention of killing British s oldiershe has no rights end of argument. This is why is Britain is in the mes s it is.

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stealthbong

02/16/2010 12:26 AM

This is a cretinous article.

"Why dont our judges just come clean and s ign up with the Taliban? Every timethey are asked to choose between the defence of the realm , or upholding therights of some Islamic militant who claims his human rights have been violated,the judges invariably find in favour of the latter."

Maybe this is due to this governments demonstrably cavalier approach toupholding the human values of a western democracy. And not the bias of our

judges.

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ackthesmilingblack

02/15/2010 07:10 AM

Taser: TeleActive Shock Electronic RepulsionYou can't screw with an acronym.Cf. laserYou're off the mark regarding torture, too.

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senekaross

02/15/2010 01:56 AM

.http://japan-russia.jimdo.com/....

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alanstoddart

02/12/2010 03:41 PM

Hardly torture.

But interesting that a self confessed m ember of Al Qaeda, trained in weapons,explos ives and di rty bombs, who was on his way to the US to carry out an attackwith a man who has been convicted in the US of terror crimes s hould beconsidered a victim.

If police officers can tazer a man several times in an arrest, then surely gentle'torture' to prevent terror attacks mus t be also acceptable level of violence?

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eddieelgar

02/12/2010 09:45 AM

"War is the terrorism of the rich and powerful,Terrorism is the war of the poor and powerless ".

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rosina

02/12/2010 07:04 AM

Earlier on a comment was m ade about allowing a Hindufuneral pyre, how come when the people of this country are not allowed to have abonfire in their back gardens, which had been common practice for years ?It is not part of our culture,we follow the rules of this land when someone dies ,ifsom ething different is required the body should be taken back to their homeland,not change our laws again, religion or no religion.

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grumpy ol ben

02/12/2010 05:06 AM

I'm pleased that at least some people understand the iss ue. I'd have hoped thatthe points I outlined were s elf-evident and a matter of common knowledge, butseemingly not.

There is, of course, a fundamental weakness with our judiciary which theAmerican one does n't share. this is, of course, that judges are appointed by themonarch but on advice from HMG; they are therefore de-facto tenured appointeesof the ruling party.

combine this with a central characteristic of the prevailing ultra-liberal philos ophy,the denial of the very existence of alternative phi losophies which do not accept orsubscribe to their world view, and the path to appointing judges from alien cultureswho place their cultural imperatives above equality before the law, preciselybecause this principle is not part of their culture, is wide open.

furthermore, there is no effective process by which the process of deciding what

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the law actually means in prctice - one of the important functions which judgesserve - can be moni tored. It is a complex, expensive, protracted procedure tochallenge a s ingle ruling, and when it is done the outcome is a highly specificruling of limited application.

European judges are in a somewhat different position, which is precisely whyFrench judges, for example, can decide that no benefits are payable without 3years' tax payment, German and Dutch legis lators can introduce restrictions onEast European immigrants, or Spanish judges can render British expatshomeless by the byzantine workings of their planning system, or tell non-Spanis h

speakers to go away and learn Spanis h, or at least provide an interpreter at theirown expens e, if they expect to be s een by a doctor.

Why, in fact, do we have such huge levels of immigration? Partly politicalmanipulation on a breath-taking level, of course, but why do immigrants take suchrisks to cross the Channel? The answer, in one word - BENEFITS. In another wordor words, A LEGAL SYSTEM WHICH FAVOURS THEM UNFAIRLY AND FEARS TOSEEK TO MAKE THEM OBEY IT.

We don't, in fact, need to make them ipso facto illegal or seek to deport them intens of thousands . Given the numbers who appear to have no recognisablenationality, or come from countries which have no recognisable legal s ystemand/or have no reservations about not wanting them back, this would qui te likely

result in a fruitless game of cross-Channel ping-pong as they were shuttled to andfro in small, but locally unmanageable, numbers.

The answer is to copy the French, Spanish and others - no benefits, no nothing,without proper documentation at point of departure. A proper policy of puttingillegals straight back on the next flight or boat to their point of departure, at thatcarriers' expense. A proper policy of enforcing the doctrine that it is not, in fact, legalto marry for the specific purpose of gaining entry, or more correctly that suchmarriages are not valid for that purpose; and s imce, for example, 70% of Pakistaniimm igrants marry and import wives from Pakis tan, the implementation of thisshouldn't pose too many intellectual challenges.

All these things are perfectly legal once you break away from the doctrine that the

Human Rights Act is both paramount over all other legislation and capable ofalmost infinitely elastic interpretation. This is precisely why it is s o lax andambiguous ly worded, of course.

There is a s ignificant section of the British judiciary who hand down rulings whichgo far beyond anything required by EU law. This is precisely because they havebeen placed there by politicians, because they can be relied on to do so. CherieBlair is a particularly odious example of this , but she is far from alone.

I will now propos e that our salvation will, in fact, come from the combination of thefringe parties and Europe - insofar as it comes from anywhere at all. I don't sharethe delus ions of the half-dozen or so UKIP posters, and their sock puppets, onhere.

However the nationalis t minority parties are another matter. There is a good dealof bickering about whether parties such as the BNP are in fact, parties of the Left orRight. This is ess entially irrelevant, since they do not have any serious prospect offorming a government.

the Europeans unders tand the roots and branches of fascism better than we do,from hard experience. There are people walking the streets of any European citywith direct experience of the day-to-day working of such societies.

All major European countries have been through the cataclysm ic destruction andreconstruction of their political and s ocial structures within living memory, somemore than once.

This has involved the recognition and containment of hard-line nationalis m, at atime when the British have been allowed to retreat into nostalgia, xenophobia andinsularity - a very British characteristic, also evident in their trans-Atlantic culturaldescendants.

This has been achieved by the incorporation of nationalism into public life. I don't


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actually much care for Geert Winders (sp?), but he has a specific point and is anintegral part of Dutch political li fe. The French had Jean-Marie Le Pen.

Like them or not, and in some respects they give me the impress ion of turning intosom ething out of a Hammer Horror film at full moon, the BNP are about the onlyavailable channel by which such pressure can be brought onto the nextincumbents. The Lib Dems won't do it; they are too deluded about being 'part of theprocess', kingmakers in a hung parliament rather than stooges to be used andabused by NuLab if necess ary.

However there would seem to be every prospect by which a case could be brought,in Europe, once Lisbon is in force, to the effect that British law as held by judges inthe UK is not valid and the French, or Spanish, precedents are in fact thedetermining case.

Who will do this? The BNP, if anyone. Unlike UKIP they don't have any delusionsabout forming a government, and they certainly don't have any goodwill for the"multi-culti project". They are now part of the Ero Parliament, with the funding andresources that brings.

Our political system is now broken beyond repair in its major essentials. Thepress ing need is to get rid of NuLab, but the damage has been caused over 30years by both sides. ConLite isn't the ans wer, and the LibDems are irrelevancieswho have had their chance, and muffed it.

We now need PR, on the bas is that neither main party can be trusted to reformitself, either under FPTP or by whatever gerrymandering of the electoral systemthey seek to em brace.

We need, in fact, the very system which we were once ins trumental in es tablishingin Europe, precis ely to prevent the return of the elective dictatorships pursuingideological programmes with no reference to the wishes of the indigenouselectorate, manipulating the judiciary and transhipping entire ethnic populationsacross continents for party political purposes.

The snag is , of course, that it took the total devastation of continental Europe toprovide the opportunity.

We have s tood on the fringes of Europe, in it but not OF it, for too long. It is longpast time that we got to grips properly with then issue, because as things standwe will indeed become a backwater, isolated and exploited; well, even more thanwe already are.

alegitbritcit

02/12/2010 04:14 AM

Remember judges also interpret the law,so their own beliefs/ideology may

interfere in their ultimate descision.Why did MI5 not "lose" the referred topapers,the government and all i t's depts. do it regularly?Time to show terrorists wewill us e any methods to to obtain information for this country's protection,for God'ssake we are fighting a war.Winston must be s creaming in his grave at the way thisgovernment has handicapped the security services/armed forces to theendangerment of the British people

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worldtravellor

02/12/2010 02:03 AM

How many wake up calls do we need to remind us that there really are bad peopleout there.

As for saying this bad person has been 'roughed up' a bit, come on, he is aterrorist. We have a secret service dealing with people like that, that is why they donot tell us what they are doing, while trying to keep the country safe. Stop the floodof people like this coming into the uk.

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Give the heads of our judges a s hake.

mijassteve

02/11/2010 04:48 PM

Judges uphold the rule of law,Coughlin upholds the rule of journalism, I knowwhich one I fall in line behind. Coughlin 's idiotic argument is that of the secret

police and the neo conservatives, who do not give a damn for the rule of law. TheUSA have made a rod for there own back with there Nazi style internment.The us eof deplorable means of eliciting information aligns them wi th the likes of Papa Doc& Pinochet.

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warden

02/11/2010 04:08 PM

The purpose of the exercise was to define 'the West' and justify your claim that"Islam declared war on the West around fourteen hundred years ago, and has,with odd paus es, been continuously hammering away at us ever since." Grumpy olben's post is on an entirely unrelated attempt to "define The West as a specificentity, distinct from Islam".

It seems that your sweeping, trans-historical assumption is based on little morethan the much-publicised conques t of al-Andalus and a handful of battles at timeswhen Chris tians and Muslims were far busier fighting their own. When you talk of'Islam ', a term you have a very limi ted comprehension of, does your knowledgeextend beyond the Ottoman Empire as far as, say, India, Iran, Central Asia or any ofthe other lands that have been home to the majority of the world's Musl ims for thelast thousand years?

"Are you a product of the Socialist education system that blames all the Worldsills on the Evil British Empire before the existence of which all was s weetness and

light in the World, by chance?"

Incorrect. I am a 'product' of the private school education system, which, in myexperience, seeks to encourage independent thought and enquiry in students. Iam not a socialis t. I do not blame all the World's ills on the British Empire. I dohope you can build a better straw man than that.

"The Muslims firs t crossed the Straits of Gibraltar around AD 711, and thereafterwe were constantly at war with them on the European mainland,, encompas singsuch events as the Crusades and the Varna campaign of 1444 until John IIISobieski of Poland lifted the second siege of Vienna in 1683."

Aside from you having switched the argument from them hammering away at us to

us crusading against them, it may come as a surpris e to you to learn that the vastproportion of the Muslim world was barely even aware the Crusades were takingplace. Muslim hegemony during those centuries centred on the empires of theTurks, Mongols and Mamluks. The idea that Muslim s in this period formulatedtheir world view on the bas is of an East/West paradigm would not be endorsed byany credible scholar. If you fancy yourself as a student of history, Catweazle,interrogate it from different angles and perspectives and remem ber to approach itwith a broad understanding.

"Now, using different tactics and funded by petrodollars , theyre back."

The "different tactics" being the mass immigration encouraged by success iveConservative and Labour adm inistrations?

"We already have no-go areas in our Northern towns and cities , along with honourkillings and arson attacks on the homes and bus inesses of moderate Muslimswho refuse to pay the Islam ists protection money to finance Jihad, to name but acouple of the illegalities that are spreading rapidly in our country."

Isolated instances us ed to tarnish an entire religion. The sam e can be done to any

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group. A slightly more worrying illegality took place when our prime minis terdecided to invade Iraq and contribute to the deaths of 1.2 million Iraqis.

"Then there is the completely insane introduction of Sharia law into our country,which has at a stroke undone several hundred years of emancipation of women,and further, pretty much legalised the right of Muslim men to beat their wives anddaughters, so long as they dont mark their faces, that is."

or, put another way...

Vermin like the Mohamed used to be properly interrogated and then s hot in theback while trying to escape, or better, wrapped in a pigskin and buried al ive. Timewe returned to the old ways. (Catweazle)

You have now revealed yourself to be a dim-witted xenophobe, Catweazle.

fiatlux

02/11/2010 03:11 PM

does anyone know what this person as been accused of? As Binyam M. actuallybeen actively conspiring to committ acts of terrorism agains t the UK?

If he has then his torture is well des erved

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realist8

02/11/2010 02:43 PM

Con, what an apt name as your articles are generally an utter con playing topeoples prejudices . Now you want to blame judges if a bomb goes off... whatworld do you live in and how can we get you back to planet earth?!

You're a typical cheerleader for the GWoT and the many crimes we have commited

in our vastly disproportionate respons e to the attacks on 9/11 including thatludicrous detour into Iraq. You do realise we wouldn't have been attacked on 7/7 ifwe hadn't been in Iraq don't you and every intelligence agency warned the govt. thatinvading Iraq would make us more of a target? Well that turned out to be highlyaccurate.

As to the people saying 'hang the judges' what the hell is wrong with you? I meanseriously people grow up.

Pragmatist you said -

The Judiciary in the UK along with ALL Politicians and Senior Police Officers arethe result of 50 YEARS of University staffed by a LEFT WING, ISLAMOPHILE

Academ ia. Our Universities have been churning out brainwas hed PC, MC, GreenNAZI, Islamophile, left wing, moonbats since the 60s and now they INFESTeverything.

Hmmm sounds like some resentful rubbish to me, I'm a current studen and haveboth right and left wing lecturers all of whom m anage to be much more civil andcordial to each other than you seem to be and encourage us to thinkindependently. Why are so full of hate and fear? Get out, get some exercise andrealise life is good. Also realise you're much more likely to be run over by aspeeding driver than by a terrorist but then again it wouldn't surprise me i f youwere agains t speed cameras too. Oh and if the trades des criptions act couldextend to names you'd be in deep trouble mate as your attitudes and knee jerkreactions are anything but pragmatic.

When will people realis e we, as in the UK, are not a world power and haven't beenfor a long tim. It's well past time for us to readjus t

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osephe

02/11/2010 01:52 PM

These are acts of war that these terrorists are committing .

Terrorists are not worthy of our constitutional rights .

Treating this like a mere law enforcement matter places our country at great riskbecause that s not how radical Islam ic extremists are looking at this .

They know we`re at war, and to win that warwe certainly don`t need a lecture a la Goldstone int`l Sharia Law criteria .

Nor these Sharia law judges bending over backwards to accommodate terroristBinyam Mohamed .

Joseph.EGivatayim-Israel

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pjimq

02/11/2010 11:11 AM

White House counsel, Gregory B. Craig, did the heavy lifting to push for the shutdown of Guantanamo Bay and the release of documents/pictures of prisonerabuse. Many uninformed posters on this site claim that the USA released infoabout the treatment of the prisoners . This was so disl iked by everybody in Americaexcept the left wing social ists that Obama was forced to sacked his long timefriend for having anything to do with the release of info and no information hasbeen s hared with regards to interrogation or treatment. Your courts choice to

release this information will greatly reduce USA's willingness in future intelligencesharing at great cost to your country. Obama is s cared because all the Liberals aregetting voted out of office and soon we will be a respected and feared world poweragain. You guys are my ancestors and I feel for your governments liberal agendabut trust me in telling you that this judgment will hurt both of our intelligence wings:(

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Turnberry18

02/11/2010 08:08 AM

so, mr coughlin, you sugges t our judges approve that this country resorts to theuse of torture? this could perhaps easy to implement, why doesnt thisgovernment state under statute that the use of torture is permis sable? its no usecomplaining that our judges have found us to be breach of international law whenour policy makers have signed up for it; your piece is m ischeivious and m ore akinto a scapegoat leader, and sugges ts that these lawyers are acting from an ethicalrather than legal framework. now to the ethics: there is very little evidence thattorture actually works, and quite a degree of evidence that those being tortured aremore likely to tell their torturers what they want to hear, that is an importantdistinction, but doesnt deal with the more important question- do we really want tobelong to a s ociety that adminis ters torture in order to gain information; wheredoes this end? You then end your piece with might have been the pretext of yourcomplaint in the first place (and a very dangerous pretext it is) you s tate a veryinformed suspicion that the Americans , alarmed at the willingness of our judgesto humiliate them in public, decide to scale down the level of cooperation, ournational s ecurity will undoubtedly be placed in jeopardy, is that really the case? ifso, then it is the duty of our government to get clarity on this; after all, the lives ofour soldiers are being us ed to chase after american folly around the middle east,the least we should expect is for them to inform when the implementation of these

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policies put our civilian population in peril. no, mr coughlin, maybe we wont blamethe judges when the next bomb goes off in london, maybe wel blame those whomay have obtained false information through torture

peterhirsch

02/11/2010 07:19 AM

Mr Couglin, the United Kingdom s till has some shreds of honour left and stillsom e respect for the rule of law, for justice and for civilized behaviour.

Most of the Queens subjects require their government to subscribe to standardsthat exclude torture. Most of us regard torture as barbaric. It is illegal here. We donot want to be associated with those that practice it and that practice must beexposed, whether it is approved by backward countries like Iran or by the Uni tedStates. And if the government of the United States does not want its use of tortureexposed, then it mus t not practice it or permit it.

That does not mean in any way that we should fail to go after terrorists and thosewho promote terrorism in our own country: and expel them to where they camefrom or to places like what they would wis h to make our country. Or lock them upfor much, much longer than we do.

Nor does it mean we should go interfering in other people's countries andbecoming involved in foreign mi litary adventures both illegal and likely to be neitherprofitable nor successful.

We do not like it when judges are too lax, so that the law is not applied. Nor do weapprove of laws that oppress our ancient freedoms. Nor will we tolerate the abuseof law - national or natural - by governments and their servants.

On this occasion the judges got it right. They do not always but give them creditwhen credit is due.

But you, Con, got it wrong!

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davetherave46

02/11/2010 07:03 AM

Mr Carr:I challenge your comment "Judges don't make the law.They just apply it". Ifthat is so why can Spanish judges order the destruction of homes of British expats who have no where else to live ,when our Judges order we can't touch thehomes of Travellers who have nowhere else to live? Why can France order thatBritish expats do not have the right to free French health care unless they havepaid taxes into the system for at least 3 years,whereas British Judges would say it

was an infringement of a basic human right if our Government tried to do the samehere?. Why isn't France ordered by her judiciary to provide homes and welfareservices for the refugees l iving rough in Calais ? Why can Italy and France deporttheir undesirables and we can't even though they have signed up to the sameHuman Rights Act?

The answer is:Our Judges don't apply the law as it is but as they think it shouldbe.They are unelected and m ake me feel it is no use voting in the coming electionbecause any Party's manifesto will be defeated in the Courts not in the debatingchamber. How do I know there are not some Judges who have a personal poli ticalagenda?

We have jus t had a Judge direct that a Sikh child can carry a ceremonial dagger inschool. The judge was a Sikh. why didn't he excuse him sel f from the case?

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david

02/11/2010 07:01 AM

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1 2 6 Next

Human rights people, what about my human rights?. Born and bred here, 71yrsold, live in a north wes t city frightend to go out at night. We are OVER RUN withimmigrants!.

PeterH

02/11/2010 06:42 AM

Why is it that the Human Rights people very rarely, if ever, complain about theTaliban or Somali pirates, or any of the terrorist organisations about theirdisregard for human rights?

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ollyjack

02/11/2010 05:52 AM

No Con I don't blame the judges . I blame the Labour party for throwing open thedoors to uncontrolled immigration in 1948. The Cons ervatives have had 39 yearsin power in which they could have closed it again. If you don't tread in dog sh*t you

don't trail it into your house do you.

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antrich

02/11/2010 05:44 AM

I have heard it all - Please try to appreciate that in order to win the overall battle weneed to show that our system is better than the one our Opponents us e. To do thatwe need to be open about what and how e do i t. Apply undue force to a Prisonerand he/she will jus t tell you what you want to know. Persuade him that our justsystem is better and you will have a friend for life. Remember that suppress ion

has never succeeded in the annuls of his tory!

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nittwitt

02/11/2010 05:21 AM

@pragmatist

I hadn't heard of the IRA buffoon before? Are they muslim terrorists that we'refighting in the war on terror?

What a dumb as s! A true Telegraph chinles s wonder.

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When the next bomb goes off in London, blame the judges – Telegraph Blogs