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© The Bulletproof Executive 2013
Transcript of “Harsha Chigurupati”
Bulletproof Radio Harsha Chigurupati
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Bulletproof Radio Harsha Chigurupati
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Speaker1: BulletproofRadio,astateofhighperformance.
Dave: Hey,it'sDaveAspreywithBulletproofRadio.Today'scoolfactofthedayisonethatalmostno
oneknowsabout.It'sthatthelongesthangoveronrecordisfourweeks,whichwassetby,youwould'veguessedthis,right?ByaScottishman.Thisisnotajoke,hedranksixtypintsofbeeroverfourdays,andhedidnothavethescientificknowledgethatthebubblierthedrink,theworsethehangover,becausethegascausesyourpyloricvalvetoopenandthealcoholmovesmorequicklyintoyoursmallintestineandbloodstream.TheScottishman'sdoctorconfirmedthisdiagnosis.Heprobablygotwhatwascomingtohim,butitiskindofafunnyfactoftheday.
Ifyou'vebeenlisteningforawhile,youknowthatI'mnotonetowastetime.Oneofthethingsthatmakesyoufeelreallygoodistolookgood,andthere'sabunchofresearchthatsaysthatwhenyoulookgood,youfeelgood,andpeopletreatyoudifferently.Youactuallymakemoremoney,andyou'llbemoremotivated.Youcanactuallyhavemoreenergywhenyoulookgood.OneofthethingsthatI'veneverparticularlybeenafanofisgoingoutandshopping.Idon'tthinkI'malone,asaguy.TheFiveFourClubprovidesasimple,affordablewaytoexpandyourwardrobe.It'sapersonalizedmemberexperience,andit'sgotdependablehow-to-wearstylesuggestions,acuratedcollectionselectedbyapersonalstylistforyou,freesizeexchanges,freedelivery,andeasystyleprofileedits,andthere'sexclusivity.
TheclothingyougetthroughtheFiveFourClubisonlyavailablethere.It'sindependentdesign,production,anddelivery,andwhenyougetitinyourregulardeliveryitprovidesanauthenticconnectionbetweenyouandFiveFourClub.Itmakesyoulookgood,makesyoufeelgood,andthatactuallydoesmakeyouperformbetter.Don'tforget,gotofivefourclub.comandusethepromocodeBULLETPROOFatsignuptogetfiftypercentoffyourfirstpackage.That'spromocodeBULLETPROOF,forfiftypercentoffyourfirstpackage.
Beforewegetgoingontheshow,ifyouhaven'teverhadachancetocheckoutBulletproofUnfairAdvantage,youtotallyshouldcheckthisstuffout.ThereasonisthatthisisthemostimportantsupplementthatI'vemadeinmycareersofar,anditcomesinthispackagethat'slikeTransformers,morethanmeetstheeye.Ifyou'rewatchingthevideoonbulletproofexec.com/youtube,you'dbeabletoseethisstuff.Itcomesinlittleampules.Thereasonyoutakeitisthatit'sawholebodynootropic,oraperformanceenhancer.Youhavethemostmitochondriainyourbrain,andwehaveaproprietaryformofsomethingcalledPQQ.Wesynthesizedthestuff.It'snottheformeveryoneelseuses,it'scalledActivePQQ.
Whatitdoesisitpromotesoptimalnervefunction,optimalheartfunction,anditboostsyourmitochondrialperformance.Youhavethisamazingenergyforawhileafteryoutakeitwithoutrelyingonanykindofstimulantsoranythingelselikethat.Sincewe'retalkingaboutalcoholtoday,andyou'regoingtolearnalotaboutalcohol,UnfairAdvantageisanamazinghangoverhack.Yougetgroggyandcrankythatnextmorning,giveyourselfalittlemitochondrialboost,you'reamazedatwhatyourbraincando.Headonovertobulletproof.com.It'scalledUnfairAdvantage,theworld'sfirstwholebodybroadspectrumnootropic.It'llabsolutelykickyourass.It'samazing,andyoucansleeponitjustfine.
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Allright,enoughaboutthatstuff.Let'sgetintotoday'sshow,whichisaboutalcohol.Today's
guestisHarshaChigurupati.IthinkIsaidhislastnameexactlyperfectly,butI'mnotentirelysurebecausethatlastTisasoftT,andsayingasoftTisn'tthatnaturalformebecauseIalwayswanttosay"th",butIdidmybest.Harsha,welcometotheshow.
Harsha: ThanksDave.Youdidaprettygoodjobwiththelastname,andgreatseguefromtheproductontothetopicofalcohol.
Dave: I'mhappytohelp.Harsha'sontodaybecausehe'sapharmaceuticaltechnologyentrepreneurandhe'srunningaresearchcompanycalled,funnyenough,ChigurupatiTechnologies.Hiscompanyis—thisisabig,broadgoal—aidingtheevolutionofmankind.Thewayhe'sdoingthatis,aftereightyearsofresearchhe'smakinganewcategoryofalcoholicbeveragescalledFunctionalSpirits.He'scomeupwithagamechangingliver-friendlyalcoholusingamoleculecalledNTX.
Thedefinitionofbiohackingischangingtheenvironmentaroundyouandinsideofyousoyouhavecontrolofyourownbiology.Thatletsyoudowhateveryouwanttodo.Inthiscase,youwantedtodrinksomething,youdidn'twantittomakeyouagemorequickly,getmorecancer,andbasicallytrashyourbody.Well,maybehackingthealcoholisthewaytodoit.That'sgoingtobeafascinatingepisode.We'regoingtodelveintowhatalcoholactuallydoesandwhatyoucandoaboutit,thenhowyoucantakecontrolofyouralcoholbeforeittakescontrolofyou.How'sthatforatagline?
Harsha: That'sgreat,actually.Letmetellyou,it'snotveryoftensomebodysharesmythoughtofchangingtheenvironmentaroundyouasperwhatyouseefitorasperyourrequirementsversusadaptingtotheenvironmentitself.That'sexactlywhatChigurupatiTechnologiesdoes.Thegoalistoaidintheevolutionofmankind,andwedothatbasicallybyfocusingonR&Dandcomingupwithtechnologiesthatessentiallyletsyoudowhateveryouwanttodowithouthavingtopayforit.It'slikehavingyourcakeandeatingittoo.That'sthetechnologyweworkon.
Dave: I'mafanofmountinglasersinmyforehead.Ihaven'tquitegotthatyet,butI'mgoingtodoit!Justkidding.
Harsha: Oneday.
Dave: We'llgettheresomeday.Actually,I'mnotevenafanofthattobeperfectlyhonest.There'salreadylasersinmyforehead.They'recalledmitochondria.Theyjustdon'tshinethatbrightlyexceptwhenIdocertainthingstothem.
Harsha: Fairenough.
Dave: Ofallthethingsyoucould'vedone,whatmadeyougoafterNTX?Whatisthisstuff?
Harsha: Okay.Doyoudrinkalcohol,Dave?
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Dave: Onveryrareoccasions.Ifindalcoholisnotaperformanceenhancingsubstance.Ihaveawhole
infographicpeoplecandownloadwhereItalkabout,"Thisalcoholhastheleastmitochondrialtoxinsinit,theleasthangovereffect,themost..."ItendtodovodkaorlatelyDryFarmWines.Bytheway,bulletproofexec.com/winehasacoolthing,onepennyforabottleofmycotoxin-freewine.Forthemostpart,ifthewine'solderthanme,I'lltakethehit.Otherwise,Idon'treallywantto.That'skindofthegeneralanswerthere.
Harsha: Allright,fairenough.Let'sgobacktowhywedecidedtofocusonalcoholasoneofourfirstmajorprojects.Listen,nobodyinthehistoryofthisplanet,Icantellyou,wokeuponedayandsaid,"Youknowwhat?Ifeellikeruiningmylivertoday.Letmegograbadrink."Weallknowwedrinkalcoholattheendofthedaybecauseofthepositiveattributesofit,whichusuallyendsupbeingtherelaxationfactororthebuzzfactor.
Dave: Liketogetlaid,isthatwhatIheardyousay?
Harsha: That'sanextension.That'snotwhatIsaid.Iseeitcouldbeanextensionofthat,butthebuzzfactor,despitewhatyoumaysayaboutthetaste,classydrinking,whateveritis,it'sreallythebuzzfactor,therelaxationfactor.
Dave: Sure.It'sadrug,right?It'sarecreationalsubstance.
Harsha: That'susuallywhatitis.Let'scallitforwhatitis.Wedon'tdrinkalcoholbecausewewanttoessentiallymutilateourDNAorstressoutourliver.Theseunfortunatelywerebyproductsofenjoyingthealcohol,andwethoughtforthelasttenthousandyearsthatit'sjustsomethingwehadtoaccept.Thekeycamedownto,"Iwanttobeabletoenjoymyalcoholwithoutaffectingmyliver,sowhynotgoafterit?"Thisispossiblythemostunevolvedproductintheentireworld.LikeIsaid,there'sbeennochangeforovertenthousandyears.It'sjustripeforthepicking,goingafterthis.
Dave: Itisindeed.I'velookedatalcoholforalongtime,andI'mlike,"Youknowwhat?"IhitthispointincollegewhereIrealizedmyfavoriteFridaynightwasatripleespressoandasixpackofwhateverwascheapversusjustasixpackofwhateverwascheap,becauseitjustmademewanttogotosleep.ThenIrealizedatacertainpointthatatripleshotofespressoactuallymademehappierthanasixpackanyway,butthat'sbadforyoursleeptoo.They'rebothsomeofnature'soldestrecreationalsubstances,alongwithtobacco.Thosearethebigthree,andmaybeayahuascaistheotheroneifyouwanttogobacktoancienthistory.It'sprobablyripeforthepicking,I'dsay.
Harsha: Allright,fairenough.Let'sgetintowhatNTXis.Longstoryshort,NTXisatechnologythatessentiallyletsyouenjoyalcoholwithouthurtingyourbody.
Dave: I'mgoingtochallengeyouonthatone,becausealcoholdoeslotsofbadstufftothebody.
Harsha: Okay,youknowwhat?Fairenough.TheconceptofFunctionalSpiritswassuch,obviouslyNTXisnotcompletelybulletproofbutitdoesreduceitsignificantly,andwe'llgointosomeofthedata
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aswemoveforward.
Dave: I'malloverharmreduction.Let'sfaceit,peoplearegoingtodrink.Idon'tthinkevenwithNTXthatdrinkingisprobablygoingtobethehealthiestpossiblethingyoucouldpossiblydo.Myguessisthatsittinginanashramfastingmightbehealthierthandrinking,butlet'sfaceit,you'renotgoingtodoit.It'sFridaynightandyou'reoutwithfriends,soit'sokaytodrink.Whenyou'regoingtodoit,justknowwhatyou'redoinganddoitintelligently.Ibelieveyou'vegotsomecoolstuffthere.Tellmewhat'sinit,andwhatdoesitdo.
Harsha: Allright.BasicallyNTXisablendofthreeingredients:Glycyrrhizicacid,whichisessentiallyextractfromthelicoriceroot,thenthere'smannitolandpotassiumsorbate.Theseareingredientsthatarenotreallyknown,atleastthreeoftheseingredientstogether,toprotecttheliver.Yes,there'ssomedataaboutlicoriceextract,etcetera.Ofcourse,likeyousaid,it'seightyearsoftesting.Whatwe'verealizedisafterdozensanddozensofclinicaltrials,we'veessentiallybeenabletomixandmatchthesethreeingredientsincertainproportionsthatactuallyhelpsitactsynergisticallytogethertoprotecttheliver.
Dave: Thepotassiumsorbateisn'tapreservative,it'sactuallypartoftheeffectontheliver?
Harsha: Itactuallyisapartofit.Alotofpeoplethinkit'sjustthefirsttwoingredients,mannitolandglycyrrhizicacid,butno,potassiumsorbateisactuallyaveryimportantpiecetothewholecomponent.
Dave: Now,whatnormallyhappenswhenyoudrinkalcoholintheliverisitdepletesglutathione.OneofthethingsIrecommendisImakeaglutathionething.I'mlike,"Look,ifyou'regoingtobedrinking,maybeproppingupglutathionebeforeandafterisjustagoodidea,anddon'ttakeTylenolatthesametimebecausethat'sastupididea."Basicstufflikethatcanhelpyounothaveabadliver.Areyougoingbeyondtheglutathioneeffects?Areyoulookingatacetaldehyde?What'sreallygoingoninthere?
Harsha: JustbecauseyoubroughtupTylenol,let'skeepthatdiscussionforlater,becausethere'sagreatstorybehindthat.Letmefocusonalcohol,howitbasicallyworksonthesystem,andwhatNTXdoes.Asyouhadsaid,oneoftheissuesiswhenalcoholismetabolizedbecauseofthefreeradicalsinit,itdepletestheglutathione.Takingastepbackagain,it'snotreallyalcohol-alcoholthat'sreallybadforthebody,it'sthemetabolismofalcohol.Likeyousaid,alcoholbecomesacetaldehyde,thenessentiallyit'smetabolizedintoacetate,carbondioxide,etcetera.Duringthisprocess,justlikeanychemicalreactions,unwantedbyproducts,andhereduringtheinitialstages,thebyproductshappentobefreeradicals.
Alotoffreeradicalsaregenerated,andasyouandpeoplelisteningwouldknow,freeradicals,whattheybasicallydois,veryunstablemolecules,theygoandtheystealeletronswherevertheycanfind.Intheprocess,theyendupmakingthemoleculestheystealtheelectronsfromunstable.Whathappensiswhenthecellwallsbecomeunstable,thecellwallsdie,cytoplasmleaksout,causescelldeath.That,onamassivelevelontheliver,isreallywhyalcoholisbadfortheliver.
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Now,NTXhasthreemaintherapeuticactivitiesthatactuallyreducetheharmcausedbyalcoholmetabolismontheliver.NTXhascertainantioxidativeproperties.Whatthatessentiallydoesis,let'spicturizefreeradicalsassoldiersthataregoingtogoanddamagethelivercells.Theantioxidantsbasicallyneutralizesomeofthosefreeradicalsfromattackingtheliver,sothefirstpartisthere'ssomeprotectiongoingon.ThenwealsoseethatNTXhascertainanti-inflammatoryaswellasimmuno-modulativeproperties.Whatthatbasicallydoesisitactuallyhelpstheliver,butweknowtheliveristheonlyorganthatregeneratesitself.Itatuallyhelpstheliverregenerateevenquickerthanitwouldonitsown.
Usingthesethreetherapeuticactivities,we'veseeninclinicaltrialsthatweredoneallovertheworld,actually—inIndia,intheUS,etcetera—thatoverall,therewasaprotectionofoverninety-threepercentontheliverwhenyoucomparedpeopledrinkingjustavodkaversusavodkamadewithNTX.
Dave: Now,howareyoumeasuringharmreductionintheliver?What'sthemetricforliverprotection?
Harsha: WhatbasicallyhappensiswhenyougotoyourdoctorandhegivesyouLFTs,whichisyourliverfunctiontest,whathebasicallyislookingforis...Theytakeyourbloodandtheyessentiallyarelookingforcertainenzymesandthelevelsofthoseenzymesinthebloodstreamwhenyourliverisunderstress,becausebasicallythesecellsbreakout,theseenzymesleakoutintothebloodstream.Thehigherthelevelofenzymes,themoreunderstressyourliveris,andofcoursedoctorsandscientistshavebasicallytolduswhatthebaseleveliswhenyourliver'snotunderstress.
YoulookatcertainenzyemslikeALT,AST,GGT,ALP,justdifferentenzymes,andwhenyoulookatthelevelsinthebloodstream,anelevatedenzymemeansliverbeingunderthemoststress.
Dave: Okay,soit'sliverenzymetesting.Gotit.
Harsha: That'soneofthemainways.
Dave: Ibelievethat.WhenyousayvodkamadewithNTX,doyoudistillthevodkathenyoupourinsomeNTXandthat'showitworks?
Harsha: Yeah,that'sbasicallywhatitis.Themanufacturingprocessuntiltheendendsupbeingthesame.Now,thisismadeforallspiritsthatgofromthirty-fivetofifty-fivepercentalcoholbyvolume,andthestrengththeymetabolizewithversussomethinglikebeerorwineisalittledifferent.Basically,aftermanufacturing,weadditinthefinalmixingstageinthequantitythatwe'resupposedtodoitat,andessentiallyweendupfillingthebottles.
Dave: Whydon'tyoujustputitinacapsuleandtakeit?
Harsha: Well,thewaywedevelopedNTXiswedeveloepditspecificallykeepingafewlimitationsintoaccount.Firstofall,letmeputitthisway,ifyoutakeapill,thereisaverygoodchancethatyouwon'tgetthemostoptimizedeffectthereisbecausesomeofthese...Firstofall,whenyoutake
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apill,thetimingoftakingthepillversusNTXdifferentiatessignificantly.Whenyoudothat,thechancesofmisusealsoincrease.Peoplecertainlythink,oh,theycantakefive,sixpillsandthatdeliveryiscompletelybulletproofandthatyoucandrinkallthealcoholtheywanted.
Whatwewantedbasicallywasanoptimizeddosagewhichisconsumedalongwithalcoholitself.Forexample,wetalkedaboutantioxidativeproperties.Thewaythealcoholisbeingmetabolizedrightnow,andtheantioxidativepropertiesofNTXenterrightaway,neutralizingit,thingsalongthosenature,makethismoreeffectivewhichiswhythetimingisextremelyimportant,whichiswhyit'salwaysbetterifit'smanufacturedwiththealcoholitself.
Dave: Ihearyou,there.Thatmakesgoodsense.You'redealingwiththealdehydespike,ornot?Doyoumeasureacetaldehydeformation?Thiscausesadvancedglycationendproductsthroughoutthebodywhenyoudrinkalcohol.That'soneofthereasonsIwasalittleskeptical.You'vegotlessharmingtheliver,butareyouessentiallyagingtissuesthroughoutthebodywhenyoudrinkstill,orareyoudealingwiththateffectaswell?
Harsha: Well,thethingis,thesadpartisweknowacetaldehydeisacarcinogen,butatthesametime,itisalsowhatcausesthebuzzfactorthatwedrinkalcoholfor.
Dave: It'spartofit,right?There'saGABABreceptorthingthat'sgoingon.
Harsha: There'sasignificantportionofit,andthethingiswehaven'treallyhitalevelofsophisticationwherewecanplayaroundwithitwithoutaffectingthebuzzfactor.
Dave: Ifyoureducethealdehydespikethatdoescausetissueaging,butnotliverharmnow,thenpeopledon'tenjoyitasmuch.
Harsha: Exactly.Whilewedidfocusontheliverastheendproduct,NTXhasoverallprotectiveproperties,butreallyitdependsonwhichtissueswe'retalkingabout,whichpartofthebodywe'retalkingabouttoseewhattheprotectionactuallyis.Forexample,totakeitfurther,we'vealwaysfocusedontheliverasis,butinourattempttoshow...Alotofpeopleessentiallyreactbysaying,"Oh,myliverwillonlybehurttenyearsdownthelineifIdrinktoomuch.Youknowwhat?Drinkingalcoholisfinenow."Weweretryingtoeducatethem,showingthat,"Listen,withinfifteenminutesofdrinkingalcohol,yourliverisunderstress.Yes,itmaynotbedamaged,becauseifyou'relookingatactualenzymes,elevatedenzymesinthebloodstream,thenit'salreadydamaged.
Wetriedtolookatdifferentmeasurements,andwhatwecameupwithwasamethodtonotonlymeasuretheoxidativestresslevelsten-fifteenminutesafterdrinking,butalsoawaytoshowforDNAdamage.WewerealsoabletoshowprotectiveeffectsofNTXfifteenminutestotwohoursafterdrinkingalcohol.
Dave: Cool.Ifyou'repreventingtheDNAdamage,thatisrealvalue.DNAdamageisn'tahormeticstress.Ahormeticstressor,forpeoplelistening,hormesisistheideathatwhatdoesn'tkillmemakesmestronger.Sometypesofthings,likeliverstressisactuallyhormetic.Analcoholicwhodrinksallthetime,they'vetrainedtheirliver.Eventhoughthey'restillcausingharm,they've
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trainedtheirlivertobeabletohandlemoretoxin.Theycandrinkaquartofvodkathatwouldputmeunder,andtheycanhandleit,buttheDNAdamagethathappensisn'tabeneficialhormeticstress.It'sactuallyjustbadforyou.It'sthesamekindofstressthat'scausedbymycotoxinsthatalsooftentimesridealong,especiallyinundistilledalcoholslikebeeroralotofwines.Thatperspectivethoughisprettycool.
Harsha: Justaddingtoit,don'taskmewhywewerethefirstpeopleintheworldtoknowthis.Iactuallywashopingtherewasmoreresearchalreadydone,butsadlythereisn't.Untillastyear,theshortesttermstudythatwasdonehappenedtobeonethatwasdoneinSpain,andtheymeasuredtheDNAdamageafteraweekendofdrinkingandshowedtheyweresignificant.Thatwasabigdealatthatpoint.Wetookittothenextlevel,againbecausewearetryingtoshowtherealimpactofalcohol,andweactuallyshowedthattwohoursafterdrinking,theDNAdamagecouldincreaseasmuchas300%.
Dave: Veryinteresting.Thiswasyourresearch?
Harsha: Thisisallourresearchthatwedid.
Dave: Whenpeoplesay,"Oh,Idrinkalcoholbecauseit'sgoodforme..."
Harsha: Firstofall,Idon'tknowwhosays,"Idrinkalcoholbecauseit'sgoodforme."
Dave: Lotsofpeoplesayit'sgoingtostopAlzheimer's.Yougetsomeofthelessevolvedpaleoguys,"Ohyeah,Idrinkalotofredwineeveryday."It'slike,whatever.
Harsha: Iunderstandthere'salotofresearcharoundit.ThisiswhatItelleverybodyIcomeacross.Isay,"Listen,ifyoudon'tdrinkalcohol,don'tstart.Butifyouaredrinkingalcohol,yeah,it'sstupidtonotdrinkanythingbutalcoholmadewithNTXbecauseit'safunctionalspirit."That'swhatItellpeople.Don'tstartdrinkingthinkingit'sbetterforyou,butbecauseyoudrinkitanyway,findasaferwaytodrinkit.
Dave: We'reinagreement.ThelastinterviewIhadwiththeguysfromDryFarmWines,samething.He'slike,"Look,micro-dosingisawaytodothis."It'sokaytodothingsthatarefunandpleasurablethataren'tgoodforyou.Justdon'tdothingsthataresuperbadforyouthatarejustaspleasurableasthingsthatareonlyalittlebitbadforyou.That'sjustcommonsense,andwedon'tteachthatcommonsenseinschool.CertainlywhenIwasgoingtoUCSantaBarbara,whichwasvotedoneofthebestpartyschoolsonthewestcoast,Idon'tevenrememberhalfofwhatIdidtherebecauseIwasdrunk,butapparentlyIhadfun.
Harsha: Welcometotheclub,unfortunately.Thewholeideaofliver-friendlyalcoholstartedjunioryearofcollege.
Dave: Iwasabouttoaskyouthat.Howdidyoucomeupwiththisideaspecifically?
Harsha: Iwasactuallyavery,verylatebloomer.IhadmyfirstalcoholicbeveragewhenIwastwentyyearsold.Drankit,enjoyedit,anditjustsohappenedthatIstarteddrinkingwhenIwastakinga
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coupleofclassesinpharmacology.Wewerelearningaboutneurotransmittersandpharmacologyofneurons,andbasicallythefirstthingthatcametomymindwas,"Okay,Iknowthere'sdefinitelyawaytomimictheeffectsofalcoholonthebrain."Itmaynotbealcohol,butyoucanmimicitwithcertaindrugsormoleculesthathaven'tnecessarilybeendiscoveredyet.Idon'twanttostressoutmyliverormyDNA.AtthatpointIdidn'tknowabouttheDNA,itwastheliver.Whynotessentiallybeabletocomeupwiththismoleculethatmimicstheeffectsofalcoholandtrytopromoteitasanalcoholicbeverage,becauseit,likeIsaid,mimicsthesameeffects?
Atthatpointthough,IknewaboutthepharmaceuticalindustrybecauseIgrewupinthepharmaceuticalindustrymyentirelife.Myparentsownapharmaceuticalcompany.Youcouldn'thaveitasadrug.Itwouldhavetobeaseasilyaccessibleasalcoholisforittobesuccessful,whichmeansyoubasicallygotoeitheraliquorstoreorasupermarketandshouldbeabletobuythisdrink.Now,todevelopasafetyprofile,getovertheregulatoryrequirements,etcetera,sothatpeoplecangotoanystoreandbuyamoleculelikethatwhichmostprobablymightbeanewmoleculeentity,god,itwouldbebillionsofdollars.Ikindofletitgoatthatpoint.
Dave: Yougaveuponthatandyoucameupwithsomething,becausethethreeingredientsyou'reusingareallGRASingredients.GRAS,forpeoplewhoaren'tintheindustry,GenerallyRecognizedAsSafe,whichisanarbitrarydesignationfromtheFDA.SomeGRASingredientsarenotsafeandsomeare.Ifyou'remagicallyonthislist,youcansellitwithoutspendingatleastseveralmilliondollarsonlabteststoshowsomethingthatpharmacologicallyisobviouslysafe.Thingslikewaterwouldbegenerallyregardedassafe,althoughyouneverknow,theymighttakeitoffthelistassoonassomeonewantstosellitasadrug.
Harsha: Well,it'sinterestingyouwouldsaythat,becauseacoupleofyearsagotheFDA,workingwiththeTTB,cameupwithalistofsomethingthatcouldbeGRAS.Doesn'tnecessarilyhavetobeGRASinalcohol.Theydidthatwithcaffeine.Iknowwhytheydidit.SometimesIunderstanditdoesn'tmakesense,butlisten,let'snottalkaboutwhat'sethical,unethical,what'srightorwhat'swrong.Thesearetheruleswehaveinplace,andthat'sthebestguidelinethatwecanworkwith,betterorforworse.
Dave: It'stheguidelinethatifyoudon'tworkwithit,yougooutofbusiness.Evenifitpreventsyoufromdoingthethingthat'sbestfortheworld,youstillworkwithinitbecauseotherwiseyou'lldonothingfortheworld.
Harsha: Thereyougo.
Dave: AtleastintheUS,that'showitis.Thescarythingisthatit'sdifferentinCanada,it'sdifferentinEurope,andit'sdifferentineverycountry.Peoplewhodon'tknowthis,IroastBulletproofcoffeeoutsideLondonandwesellBrainOctaneintheUK.It'scalledUpgradedOctane,becauseyoucan'thave"brain"onalabelinLondon.Whatever.Idon'tknowwhy.Ihadtochangethenameofoneofourmajorproducts,whichbythewayalsoaffectsalcoholintheliver.It'ssointerestingthatyou'redealingwiththesamething,butbecausealcoholisevenmoreregulatedthankstoprohibitionalmostahundredyearsago,there'sallsortsofweirdthings.Whenyou
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crossaborder,whoreallycaresifyouhavemorethanonebottleofwineornot,buttheyaskyou,tothisday.Whodoesthisweirdcrap?
You'redealingwithevenworseregulationsthanafoodcompanyhere,andyousomehowgotaroundtheredtape.Howdidyoudothat?
Harsha: ThisiswheretheTylenolstorycomesuptosomeextent,likeweweretalkingaboutearlier.ThatalsoisasegueastohowIwasabletouseingredientstocomeupwiththisconceptinsteadofjustgoingaheadwith,forlackofabetterterm,a"synthehol"likeyouseeinStarTrekandwhatnot.Ihadthisidea;Igaveitupbecause,tobehonest,Ididn'tknowhowtomoveforwardonthat,nottomentionIdon'thaveacoupleofbilliondollarsthatIcouldjustspendhopingthiswouldworkout.Myfamily'scompanyatuallyisoneofthelargestmanufacturersofacetaminophenintheworld.
Dave: Noway!
Harsha: Yeah.Ithinknumbertwointheworld.
Dave: NowI'mtruly,trulyamused.You'rebasicallyliketheliverdeathmerchants,I'vegotit.No,I'mjustkidding.
Harsha: No,letmeputitthisway:Theproductswemakeareharmfulforthelivertosomeextent;we'reworkingonmakingitnotharmful,protectingtheliver.
Dave: Ihavetoaskyouthis:Couldyoujust,asanexcipient,pleaseinclude500mgofvitaminCandsavetensofthousandsoflivesayear?Itwouldbesoeasy.
Harsha: YouandIareexactlyonthesamepagehere,andletmetellyouwhy.Weknowthis,acetaminophendoesincreasestressontheliverandasoneofthelargermanufacturers,mypassionwasalwaystrueinnovation,notreallybusiness.Iwasnevergoingtobegreatatbuyingsomethingforadollarandsellingitfortwo.Innovationiswhatdroveme.
Dave: It'smorefun.
Harsha: Itismorefunandmorerewarding,andalsotherearemanypeoplewhoarejustbetterthanmeatbusiness,period.WhatIdidiswhenIwasworkingformyfamily'scompany,Iactuallysetasideateamofscientistsandwecameupwithaprototypeofaliver-friendlyacetaminophen.
Dave: Thatwouldbesogame-changing.
Harsha: Yes,that'swhatIhadthoughttoo.Youngeryears,naïve.
Dave: Icanseewherethisisgoing.
Harsha: Therearetwolargebrandownersoftheacetaminophendrugintheworld.
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Dave: Wewon'tnameanyofthemspecifically.
Harsha: Wewon'tnameanything.Wenttothebothofthem,showedthemthistechnology,andtheylookedintothescience,everything.Amazing,scienceworks.Answerwasno.Why?Notnecessarilythatthesciencedoesn'twork.Numberone,ifyouhavetointroduceaproductwiththistechnology,younumberoneareacceptinginfrontofthewholeworld,"Yes,whatIsoldearlierwastoxicforyou.Potentiallytoxicforyou."Secondly,itbringsupanightmareoflitigation.
Dave: Themycotoxin-freecoffeecategoryhassimilarcharacteristics.Ifyou'reabigcoffeeplayer,youdon'twanttotalkaboutthatinyourcoffee,eventhoughinEuropeit'sregulated.IntheUSit'snot,sowedon'twanttotalkaboutithere.
TheFDAjustchangedwhatthey'redoingwithTylenol.Theyincreasedtheriskwarningsandallthatstuff.Here'sthething,ifyoujustaddedvitaminCwithoutsayingawordaboutit,just,"Oh,wethoughtitwouldlowerourmanufacturingcostsbyhalfacentsowedecidedtodothis,"youwouldactuallysavesomanyliveswithoutevertakingcreditforit.
Harsha: Yeah,butyouneedtounderstand,intheFDAregulations,thewayitworksisyoujustcannottakeanover-the-counterdrugandaddsomethingtoitandsellit.
Dave: You'reright.
Harsha: There'saninnovator,youreplicatetheinnovativebrandasmuchaspossible,period.Itdoesn'tmatterifyouhaveevenabetterversionofit,asmallerversion,whateveritis.Youreplicateeverything.Youreplicatethedissolutionprofile,youreplicatethebioavailabilityprofile,everything.Youdon'tinnovate,unlessyou'regoingtobeabrandleaderitself.Tobeabrandleaderinthepharmaceuticalarena,let'snottalkaboutwhatthatevenrequires.
Dave: It'sjustthedownsideofpharmaceutical,andactuallyfoodregulation.SomeofthestuffthatI'mtryingtodowithfoodisreallyhardtodobecauseofregulations.Youwanttoputfunctionalingredientsinabeverage?Youknowwhatthat'slike."Sorry,it'snotallowedtoputginkgoinabeveragebecauseit'snotgenerallyregardedassafeinwater."Youcantakeacapsulewithaglassofwater,andthat'sgenerallyregardedassafe.Whomakestheserules?That'swhatwelivewith.
Harsha: Listen,Dave,letmeputitthisway:IreallyhadanincreasedappreciationfortheFDAafterIstarteddealingwiththeTTB.
Dave: Afteryoustartedwhat?
Harsha: DealingwiththeTTB.EssentiallytheFDAdoesnothaveoversightoveralcoholintheUnitedStates.
Dave: Ah,okay.FTB,French...No,holdon,whatisthat?
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Harsha: TheagencyiscalledtheTTB,standsforTobaccoTaxationAlcoholTradeBureau.TheywereapartoftheATF.
Dave: Oh,nice.
Harsha: They'retheoneswhoregulatealcohol.
Dave: They'vegotgunsandboots,gotit.
Harsha: Ithinktheyweresupposedtohavegunsandboots,Idon'tknowiftheystillhavethem.OnethingIcantellyouaboutthemis,trustme,youwishyouwereundertheFDAonceyoustartdealingwiththesepeople.FDA,forbetterorforworse,hascertainscientificmethodologytowhytheydothings.
Dave: Theintentisoriginallygood,Igiveyouthat.
Harsha: Theintentisgood,butwhatI'mtryingtosayisthere'satleastsomescientificbasis.It'snotthateverythingisjustarbitrary.YoucometotheTTB,thisisanagencythat'sbasicallydeclaredawaronscience.
Dave: Ibettheyloveyouafteryousaidthat.
Harsha: Trustme,they'regoingtohateme.We'vebeenfightingwiththemforayearandahalfatleastnow,god.Wewillgointothattoo,butagain,I'mverygoodatveeringpeopleofftopic.
GettingbacktowhatmademeandmyteamgoaftertheseingredientsforNTX.Duringthisconceptofaliver-friendlyacetaminophen,Ipersonallyactuallyunderstoodalittlebetterabouthowthelivermetabolizeseverything,includingacetaminophen,and-
Dave: It'sfascinating.
Harsha: Exactly.Attheendoftheday,it'sadepletionofcertainenzymesthatcausestoxicity.Alcohol,tosomeextent,it'sthesamething.Glutathione,likeyousaid,isoneoftheexamples.Givenwewereabletoachievesomethingwithacetaminophen,IactuallyputateamofscientistsasideintomyowncompanyandIsaid,"Let'scomeupwithaproofofconcept."Essentiallywhatwewantedtodowasfollowthesameapproach.Wewanttobeabletocomeupwithaliver-friendlyalcoholthatdoesnotaffectthebuzz,whichisthekeyattheendoftheday,right?Everybodyknowswhyyoudrinkalcohol.Ifsomeonesays,"Yeah,thisisanalcoholthat'sbetterforyou,"butitdoesimpactyourbuzz,you'renotgoingtodrinkit.
Weendedupresearching...Wehadaproofofconceptestablishedinaboutayearandahalftotwoyears.Conceptwenttobond.itwasn'tviablebyanymeans.Itwasn'tstable,ittastedterrible,ithadIthinkaredhuecolor,etcetera,buttheproofofconcepthadbeenestablished.Afterthat,welookedattherulesinAmerica,becausetheUSwastheplacewherewealwayswantedtolaunchthistechnology.Formepersonally,thiswasreallyasmuchahomeformeasIndiawas.Ialwayswantedthelaunchtobehere,nottomentionIwenttocollegehere.
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Dave: Thereyougo.
Harsha: Thereyougo.Iwantedthesamebarstohaveourliver-friendlyalcohol.Didthat,andwhatwe
hadrealizedwastheTTB,theagencythat'sinchargeofalcohol,doesnotletyouputanythingintoalcohol,justanythingintoalcohol.Therewerealistofaboutsixtyingredientsthatwereallowedtobeaddedintoalcohol,withthelimitsset,etcetera.Whatweessentiallydidwaswelookedatthosesixtyingredients,wetookabouttwenty-fivetothirtyingredientsoutthatweknewwouldabsolutelynothaveanytherapeuticvalue.Theotherthirtyingredientswedidn'tknowhadtherapeuticvalueattachedtoit.Weactuallyknewthattheyweren'tanyvalue,sowhatwedidwasweliterallytookthesethirty,thirty-fiveingredientsthatwereleftover,andthisiswherethelackofamazingsophisticationcomesin.Wejusttrialanderroredeverything.
Sixyearsonward,wekeptontrialerroring,trialanderroring,trialanderroringeverything.Obviouslydozensanddozensanddozensofstudies,bothexvivo,invivo.Around2012wecameupwithacombinationofthesethreeingredientswhenmixedinacertainway,becauseeventhestrengthmattersthere,hadthisamazingprotectiveeffectsofalcoholontheliver.
Dave: Verycool.Whatdoesittastelike?
Harsha: OnethingIhadlearnedfrommyfather,watchinghim,wasyounever,everwanttochangetheconsumerexperience,literally.Ifyouaskaconsumerwholikestositdowntostandup,theproduct'safailureasfarasI'mconcerned.Whatwedidwaswedideverythingpossibletomakesurethattheconsumercannottellthedifference.
Dave: Okay,soit'sveryneutral.
Harsha: Yeah,soifyoudrinkavodkamadewithNTX,youreallycannottellthedifference.Maybethere'saslightsweetness,butyoucan'ttellthedifferenceatall.
Dave: Okay,cool.Isitthesamecolor?
Harsha: Everythingisthesame.Itwasmadetoessentiallyreplacetheexistingalcoholindustry.WithNTX,basicallywhatwe'veinvented,obviouslythisprotectiveeffect,whatweinventedisacategorycalledfunctionalspirits.They'resupposedtoreplaceitwithoutchangingtheconsumerexperience.
Dave: Howdidyougetthroughtheredtapetodothat?Youmentionedthatyouweredealingwithevenfightingthisforawhile.Whatwasthepath?
Harsha: Thisiswhatwedid.Bybeingabletousetheingredientsthatwerealreadypre-approvedbytheTTB,weessentiallyhadaformulationthatwaspre-approvedbeforeweevenwentthereandaskedforapproval.Until2012,alotofthemwereanimaltrials,justbecausewefounditverydifficult,especiallyinAsiaandNorthAfricawherewethoughtthepermissionswouldbeeasier,todothesestudiesonhumanbeings.Withanimalstudieswewerethinkingaboutwhattodo,andwefinallywereabletogetacoupleofCROsintheUSthatwerewillingtodohuman
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studies,ofcourseafterethicalclearance,etcetera.
OncewehadtheseresultsofhumanstudiesthatweredoneinCaliforniaactually,wetooktheseresultswithapprovedformulas,approvedCOLAsbasically.Togiveyouabriefbackground,thewaytheapprovalprocessworksforalcoholicbeverages,youfirstgettheformulaapprovedinalcohol,thenyougetsomethingcalledaCOLAwhichisaCertificateofLabelApproval.ThatmeansyoushowtheTTBwhatthelabelisgoingtolooklikeandthentheyapproveit,andthenyou'vegotacompletelyapprovedproduct.
Dave: Becauseit'sthegovernment,andit'sabeverage,theyhadtocallitaCOLAtoavoidconfusion.Gotit.
Harsha: Ofcourse.Obviously.Wewenttothemandweaskedforameeting.Wehadanapprovedproduct,andagainsttheadviceofmyTTBconsultants...It'sthisamazingtechnologythat'ssupposedtomakehumanlifebetter.Forthefirsttimeinhistory,wehavetheabilitytodrinkalcoholwithoutimpactingourliverasmuch.Wethoughtthisagencywouldappreciateit.Wewent,wehadourdoctorsfromCaliforniaflyover,wehadourdoctorsfromIndiaflyover.Nolawyers,becausewewantedthistobeopendiscussion.Wewent,three-hourdiscussion,wesaid,"Lookatthisamazingtechnology.Thisiswhatitdoes."Afterthetwoandahalfhourmeetingorso,theysaid,"Thankyouverymuchforcoming.Giveusourpermissionsback."
Dave: Whydidthathappen?
Harsha: Theydidn'tknowwhattheywereapproving.Asfarastheyknew,theywereapprovingaflavoredvodka.ThefirstproductthatNTXwasinfusedintowasavodka.Itwasapproved,everythingwasfine,butoncetheyheardthis,theyfreakedout.Obviouslywhentheyrealizedweaskedforameeting,theydidsomeresearchonthisproduct.Ithinktheyweresurprisedanybodyevenaskedthemforameeting.Anyway,theydidthat,andwhattheyhadtolduswas,"Youknowthatthingthat'scalledNTXonthebottle?"Wewerelike,"Yes..."Theysaid,"Well,thatisgoingtocausealotofconfusionwiththeAmericanconsumer,sowewantitback."
Dave: Becausewe'reallsodumb,right?
Harsha: It'sverypaternalistic,right?
Dave: Yes.
Harsha: That'sexactlywhatitis.Whenwesaid,"Whatareyoutalkingabout?"Theysaid,"Youknowthere'sadrugcallednaltrexoneinthemarketplace,andunofficiallytherearesomedoctorswhorefertoitasNTX.Wedon'twanttheeverydayconsumertothinkthatyou'reputtingnaltrexoneinavodka,"whichmakesabsolutelynosense.
Dave: TheycallitLDN,anyonewhousesiteffectively.Comeon.Theyshouldn'tdothat.Anyway...
Harsha: Theydidthat,theyusedthatasanexcuse,andtheybasicallybulliedusuntilwegavethepermissionsbacktothem.
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Dave: Wow.
Harsha: Thisisanagencythatsaid,"Wewantitback."Wesaid,"Okay,we'lltalkaboutit."Wegotkicked
outofthemeetingbasically,andtheykeptcallingourdistillersandourlawyersuntiltheysurrenderedit.
Dave: Wow.Insteadofjusttellingyoutochangethename?
Harsha: Yeah,theywouldn'tevenhaveitbecauseweallknowtheissueisn'treallythenameatall.
Dave: DidyoueverthinkofcallingitTTBjustforfun?
Harsha: Later,weactuallydidputoneofthoseasalabel.WedidZTX,wedidTTB,wedidthestupidestthingspossible.Itwascrazy,becausewewerecompletelyshockedthatthere'sthistechnologythatevolvesanentireindustry,thattheyshouldbemorethanhappyto...Thereasonwetookittothemwastofirstofallshowtheresults,andsay,"Listen,TTB,nowthatyouknowwhatthistechnologydoes,wewanttoactuallyworkwithyouandworditcarefullysoitactuallycancommunicatethebenefitstotheconsumersbutdoesnotencouragethemtobingeonit."Theywouldn'thaveanyofit.Theyjusttookitoff,theykickedusout.
Basicallythenweendeduphavinganothermeetingwiththem.Wehadrequestedit.Wesaid,"Listen,wewanttomakesurewe'reonthesamepageagain.Wedidn'twanttomakeanyhealthclaims.Wewanttoselltheproduct,yes,butwewantedtoshowyouthesciencetoshowwhatthisreallydoes.Ninety-threepercentreductionofstressontheliver.Thinkaboutwhatthismeans."Theylookedatusandtheysaid,"Yeah,wewillneverevaluateahealthstatementfortheproduct."Forgetwhatthesciencesays.
Dave: Theyjustwon'tlookatit,soyoucan'tsayit.Welcometofreespeech,right?
Harsha: Youwillseethatinthenextfewweeks,weactuallyhaveapetitionagainstthemonthebasisoffreespeech,becausetheyactuallyarecensoringfreespeechwithabsolutelynobasiswhatsoever.
Dave: Eveniftheyhaveabasis,eitherthereisfreespeechortheirisn't.OneofthemoreshockingstatementsthatI'veexperiencedatBulletproofwasaregulatorsaidflatout,"Youarenotallowedtosaysomethingabsolutelytruthfulsupportedbyadozenstudies,"aboutoneofmyproducts."You'renotallowedtosaythat."Isaid,"Butit'sabundantlytruthful.It'sveryobvious."Hesaid,"Yes,butyouarenolongerintheeraoffreespeech.Youareintheeraofcontrolledspeech."Thisisanexactquote.I'mlike,Ididn'tevenknowwhattosay.WhereI'mfrom,youactuallysaythingsastheyare.
Tothisday,IhaveseveralpeoplewhoworkforBulletproof,andwe'restillareallysmallcompany,andIputmostofmyeffortintomakingreallygoodstuffandtheninterviewingpeoplelikeyouandwritingbooksandsharingknowledge,buttherearetwoandahalfheadcountatBulletproofdedicatedtomakingsurethatwedoeverythingrightfromaregulatoryperspective.
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Wedoagoodjobonit,becauseit'spartofbeingasuccessfulcompanyinthisspace,butthecostofdoingthatisverymeaningful.Itmeansthatwhenyoubuysomethingatthestore,ameaningfulpercentageofeverydollarthatyouspendonfoodwentintothisspeechbubbleprocess.
Everythingyoureadonthelabelofeveryproductthatyoureadhasgonethroughmultiplelevelsofcensorshiptothepointthatoftentimesyouseemeaninglessstatementsonlabels,likesupportsahealthysomething.Whattheyactuallywantedtosaywas,"Therearefourthousandresearchstudiesthatsaysthatthisisgoodforyouinthisspecificway,butwe'reafraidtosaythatbecausewemightgetputoutofbusinessarbitrarily."It'sanuntenablecircumstance.Itincreasesfoodcostsandalcoholcostsdramaticallyforeveryone,andit'stotallyinvisibleunlessyou'reintheindustry.It'sprettyscrewedup,actually.
Harsha: Increasingcosts,let'snotevengothere.Atthispoint,thingshavegottensoridiculousthatjustthelegalcostsofbeingabletokeepthisstrugglegoing,Ithinkwewouldhaveatleastspenttwenty-fivetothirtypercentofourentiretenyearbudgetonjustlegalexpenses.
Dave: Mygod.Whatwasthedevelopmentcost,ifthat'spublic?Haveyouspentmillionsandmillionsofdollarsonthisstuff?
Harsha: Tensandtensandtensofmillionsofdollars.
Dave: Wow.
Harsha: Youneedtounderstand-
Dave: Bytheway,nostartuponearthwouldhavebeenabletodothat.Youdidthisbecauseyou'reworkingwithlargepharmaceuticalassetsbehindyou,right?
Harsha: Well,yeah,IwasabletoputthemintoChigurupatiTechnologies,essentially.Whatitcamedowntowas,you'reright,nostartupdoesitandit'sactuallystupidtodoit,nowinhindsight.Whenweoriginallystartedthisinlate2005,early2006,webudgetedlikefivemilliondollarsorsomething.Wesaid,"Okay,we'llgetdone,"andthenit'soverquintupled,morethanthatsincethen.It'dridiculous.Iwouldsaytherewasquiteabitofnaivetethatgotustothislevel,really.
Thethingis,thereasonitreallyendedupbeingasexpensiveasitisisbecause,youknowthis,humanclinicaltrials,properoneswithjusttensubjectsforexample,goesnorthofliketwomilliondollars.You'retalkingabouttenyearsofdoingthis,you'retalkingaboutwithdozensofhumansubjects,dozensoftests.Itgetsridiculous.Becauseofmylearningpersonallyfromthemulti-nationalpharmaceuticalcompanies,Ihadlearnedthatifsomethingwasgoingtobetruly,trulydisruptive,you'regoingtogetshutdownrightaway.
Dave: Itseemstobethecase.
Harsha: That'swhatIhadlearned.Whatwedidwaswehadtomakethisprocessasbulletproofaspossible,leaveabsolutelynochinkinthearmoratall.Wedeveloepdthisinthesamewayany
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sophisticatedpharmaceuticalcompanywoulddevelopadrug.Saywhatyouwillaboutthepharmaceuticalindustry,aboutwhatdrivestheiractions,theydohavethebestscientificprotocolsontheplanet.
Dave: Whentheyfollowthem.Wehavethingslikefen-phenwhere,like,oops.
Harsha: That'swhyIsaid,forgettheintentions,forgeteverythingelse.Wearetalkingabouttheintegrityofthetechnologyitself.
Dave: Agreed.Whentheyfollowtheirownrules,itworks.I'llgiveyouthat.
Harsha: Itisamazing.Listen,whentheysaytheydon'tknowsomething,theyknowit.Youknowthis,Iknowthis.
Dave: Right.
Harsha: Becauseofthat,theearlystage,firstyearandahalf,webasicallydidthepilotstudies,thenwewentintoexvivo,invivo.Webasicallydidabunchofanimaltrials,phaseone,phasetwo,phasethree,thenwecameouttohumans,etcetera.Asthecompanywasdoingthis,youknowthecostofdevelopingnewdrugs.They'rebillionsofdollars.Becausewedidn'tdoitforadrugwithunknowntoxicitiesbutfornaturalingredientsandwejustwantedtoprovethetherapeuticvalueofthisproduct,Iguesswecansaywekindofgotawayalittleluckyintermsofthebudgetaspectofthings,butitwasstillprettyridiculous.
LikeIsaid,thistechnologywasmadetoreplaceanentireindustry.That'sa1.2trilliondollarindustry.Youhavetodo-
Dave: It'snoteventoreplaceit.You'restillmakingalcohol,you'rejustaddingthisingredienttomaketheindustrymoreeffective,tobehonest.
Harsha: Iagreewithyou,butthenalotofpeoplewhodon'thavethetechnologywillsayit'sreplacingit,it'sacompletelybrandnewcategory,andthey'lltrytokickusoutaccordingly.
Dave: It'sanewcategory,sure,butnewcategoriesarethenatureofdisruption.Thebigguys,they'regoingtosayyou'relying,they'regoingtofightwithyou,andeventuallythey'llsayitwasobviousandthey'vealwaysdoneit.
Harsha: Whoknowswherethisisgoingtogo.
Dave: Ifyou'vereadhistory,likelythat'swhathappens.
Harsha: Letmeputitthisway,you'reright,it'snotreplacinganentireindustry,it'sanevolutionofanindustry.Justlikewhencarscamealong,therewerestillinthetransportationbusinessjustlikehorsecarriages,buttheywereanevolution.You'reright,we'restillinthealcoholbusiness,butfunctionalspiritsisanevolution.Basicallywhatitmeansisyoushouldbeabletodrinkwithouthurtingyourbody.We'reintheinitialstages.It'snotbulletproofyet,butwe'llgetthere.
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Dave: Ilovethatyou'redoingthat,andIreallyappreciatethestoryofhowyouendeduptaking
pharmaceuticaltechniquesandfranklypharmaceuticallevelsoffundingtosolveaproblemthatisn'tthathardtosolveonpaperbiochemically,buttoactuallysolveitlegallyandregulatorilytothepointyoucansaywhatitdoes.What'sthestatusofthisnow?Peoplelisteningtothisareprobablygoing,"Allright,howdoIdrinksomeofthis?"Infact,Iwouldsaythisaudience,peoplelisteningrightnow,areprobablysomeofthemoreenlightenedalcoholconsumersoutthere.Look,weacknowledgewewanttoperformwell,weacknowledgethat,yeah,we'regoingtohavefun,butwedon'twanttopaythecostofhavingfunifwedon'thaveto.Canyoubuythisnow?Iknowyou'reworkingwithBellionVodkaisthiswhat’sgoingon?
Harsha: Lalalalalala!I'mnotlisteningtoyou.I'mnotlisteningtoyou.Letmetellyouwhy.Bytheway,theTTBessentiallywentoutandputablanketbanonustalkingaboutNTX,period.Forgetiftheyconstitutionallyhavetheabilitytoornot.IamabletotalktoyouasthefounderofChigurupatiTechnologiesandNTXbecauseit'sNTXandI'mprotectedbyfreespeech,andNTXisnotcommerciallyavailableintheUnitedStates.IfIevermentionaproductthathasNTXinit,I'mnolongerprotectedbyfreespeechanditbecomescommercialspeech.That'showtheygetyou.
Dave: Oh,Iunderstand.Wewillnot,atleastyouwillnotsayanywords-
Harsha: Iwillnotsayit.
Dave: -aboutanyonelikeBellionVodka,whoissellingNTXproducts.Iunderstandthatyouhavenoideawhetheranyoneevendoessellit,right?
Harsha: Well,okay,wesupplytheproductandthetechnologysoweknowpeoplesellitintheUnitedStates.Icanalso-
Dave: What?No,no,theycan'tpossibly!Googledoesnotexist.ThepeoplewhoGoogleNTXandalcohol,Ihavenoideawhatthey'llfind.I'mtotallywithyou,Harsha.
Harsha: Waitaminute,Google?What'sthat,Google?
Dave: It'sfunny.Likewise,youshouldneverGooglewhattheingredientsinBrainOctanedowhenyoudrinkthemwithalcohol.Youjustdon'twanttodothat.
Harsha: It'scrazy.Thewholebureaucracyofitisjustridiculous.Yes,productsmadewithNTXareavailableintheUnitedStates.Ibelievethecompanywillberollingitoutalloverthenationthisyear,butIthinkthey'reavailablerightnowinaboutfivestates,Massachusettsbeingoneofthem.I'monlydefinitelysureofMassachusettsbecauseoneofmygoals,Itouchedonthisbefore,wastogetthevodkamadewithNTXintothesameliquorstoresthatIusedtobuymyalcoholfrominBostonwhenIwasincollege.
There'sthisplacecalledBlanchardsthateverykidwhogoestoBostonUniversitybuystheiralcoholat,andoneofmyfirstgoalswastogo,andIsawitthere.Thatwasagoodday.
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Dave: That'sawesome.
Harsha: WhenIwasincollege,that'swhatIwanted.
Dave: Now,whenpeopledrinkthis,dotheygetahangoverthenextday?
Harsha: Theconceptoffunctionalspirits,yes,isdeveloepdtotakeawayallthenegativeaspectsof
drinkingalcohol,whichwouldbehangover.ThiscurrentversionofNTX,wefocusedcompletelyontheliver,andofcoursebecauseitworksonamicro-cellularlevel,theDNA.Whatwewantedtofocusonwas,numberone,makingsureallthatwasprotected,thatpeople'sbodieswereprotected,beforewecameupwithanythingthathadtodowithhangoverbecausethenyoudidn'twanttobeinaposition,andit'salsounethical,thatpeopleweredrinkingmorebecausetheywouldn'tgetahangover,buthurtingtheirbodies.Itissomethingweareworkingon.I'mhappytosaywehavetheproduct.Wearefinishingsomeclinicaltrialsonit.Itwillbeoutinacoupleofyears.
Dave: IcantellyouforthelastfifteenyearsI'veseencompaniesoverandovercomeandgo,andtheycallthemselvesharmreduction.Pillsyoucantakeforafterpartying,andpillsyoucantakeforaftertakingecstasy,andpillsforafterallsortsofdrugsandalcohol,andnoneofthecompaniesevergoveryfarbecausepeoplegenerallydon'tliketoacknowledgethefactthattheyareharmingthemselveswhentheydosomethingthatfun.I'mworkingtobreakthatthingthatsays,"Look,mostthingsyoudoprobablyaren'tthatgoodforyou."
Ifyoujusthaveaspectrumandyouknowwhatyou'redoing,andyouknowhowgooditisforyou,howpleasurableitisandhowharmfulitis,andthemechanismofharm,thenyoucanchoose.Youcandialinwhereyou'regoingtobe.Ithinkthatwe'refinallymakingheadwaythere,wherethereisamarketforpeoplewhosay,"Yeah,I'mgoingtodrink.Iwanttofeelgood,Idon'twanttofeelbad."Insteadofbeinglike,"I'mtoughenoughtotakethehit,"it'slike,"Actually,I'menlightenedenoughthatIjustdon'twanttotakethehit.I'msureIcouldtakeit,butwhywouldI?"It'sthatmindsetchangeiswhatenablesthiskindofdisruptioninthemarket.
Harsha: Youaskedmeearlieraboutwhywedidn'tjustmakeitinapill.Itoldyouthetechnologicalreasonswhywedidn'tdoit.Theotheraspectalsohastodowiththeconsumerexperience.Again,oneofourgoalsatChigurupatiTechnologiesis,likeIsaid,toevolvemankind.Thatmeansthattheproductshouldbeavailableformainstreamuse,foreverybody,anditshouldnotchangetheirhabits.Ifyoutellaconsumer,youtrytofirstofallexplaintohimthekindofharmalcoholcancauseontheliverandthenyousay,"Here,takethispillbeforedoingit,"heisnotgoingtodoit.Whichiswhyweputitinthealcoholitself.Whetherhewantstoornot,whenhedrinksthealcohol,heisalreadybeingprotected.
Dave: Ihearwhatyou'resayingthere.Thisisafascinatingstory,andIknowthatpeoplewhoarelisteningcaneasilyandquicklyGoogleNTXandalcoholandfigureoutexacltywheretheycangooutandgetthisstuff.InfactImightevenbeableto,because,hey,Ihavenobusinessrelationshipwithyouwhatsoever,soI'mallowedtosaywhateverthehellIwant.I'llputsomelinksintheshownotestowherepeoplecanfindthiskindofstuff,whichisreallycool.
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I'mstillgoingtosaydrinkingisn'tahealthbenefit.Itjustisn't.However,ifyouweregoingto
drink,havingsomeofthisstuffintheresoundslikeagoodidea.Havinganyofthecompoundsthatprotectyoufromthesethings,includingalittlebitofvitaminCandalltheotherstuffthatareontheBulletproofAlcoholRoadmap,andI'llputalinktothatintheshownotestoo.Anyofthatstuffisgoingtohelp.Sure,ifyou'regoingtoparty,justreducewhatitdoestoyourbody.Haveagoodtime.There'ssuchagoodargumentforthat.
Harsha: Thekeytherebeingifyoudon'tdrinkalcohol,don'tdrink.That'sjuststupid.Ifyou'redrinkingalcohol,yes,youshoulddrinkfunctionalspirits,basically.
Dave: There'snoreasontostart.Although,actuallythereisareason.It'soneofthosethings,it'slikehavingareallygoodcheesecake.There'sbadstuffincheesecake,butthere'sapleasurablething.There'svalueinpleasure,andit'snotlikeaguiltyvalue,either.Ifyouhaveanoccasionalsmallamountofalcoholbecauseyoulikeitorbecauseyoulearntolikeit,orbecauseyouwanttotryit,Idon'thaveaproblemwiththat.Ifyou'redoingaglassofredwineeverynightbecauseyouthinkit'sgoingtomakeyoulivelonger,you'redoingitwrong.
Harsha: Exactly.Thethingis,it'sfinetodrinkalittlealcoholeverysooften.It'scompletelyfineifyouenjoyit,andit'sasociallubricant.Therearemanywaystoderivepleasureandalcoholisnottheonlyway,whichiswhyIwouldn'tsay,"Oh,youwanttoderivepleasureinthisfashion?Godrinkalcohol."No.Ifit'swhatyoualreadydoandyoulikeit,yeah,don'tchangeyourlifestyle,justdothisinasaferway.
Dave: You'readvocatingporn,isthatwhatIheard?
Harsha: Isthathowyouheardit,Dave?
Dave: Thereyougo,turnitrightbackonme.Totallykidding.You'reright,therearemanywaystoderivepleasure,andmanyofthemarenotallwholesome.We'llputitthatway,butit'skindoffunny.Iappreciatewhatyou'redoingwiththis,andIsupportyouinyourfighttobeabletostatewhatyourtechnologydoes.
Harsha: We'recallingitafighttoevolve,becauseevolvinganindustryandbeingabletocontrolourenvironment,nothavingtobeaservanttowhatpeoplecallnature,isapartofevolution,technologicalevolution.TheTTBhasbeentryingtoblockit,andwe'regoingtofight,andwearegoingtowinattheendoftheday.Yousaidsomethingearlieraboutusnotbeingabletotalkaboutthebrandthathasit,etcetera.It'sjustsadandreallyunethicalthatwehaveatechnologythatprotects,andwecan'ttalkaboutit.
Igetit,therearepeopleouttherewhomakenovelclaimsthatarecompleteBS,andyouragencieshavetobetheretoprotectconsumersfromit.Igetthat,butwhenyoudevelopaproductinalltherightways,inthemostpessimisticmannerpossible—pessimisticmeaningpeoplearegoingtotrytocomeafteryousoyouhavetomakesureit'scompletelybulletproof—andtheyblockyoufromcompletelysayingit,it'sjustterrible.That'sthereasonwehaven'trelentedyet,becausewe'veactuallyearnedtherighttobeabletoeducateconsumersonthe
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harmsofalcoholandwhythisisthebetterwaytodoit.Weactuallyarethefirstofitskindintheworld,Igetthat.Weactuallyarefilingtheworld'sfirsthealthpetitionforanalcoholbeverage,whichisneverbeenevenheardof,inAmericanextweek.
Dave: I'llpostalinktothatonFacebookandseeifwecangetsomeattentionforyouguys.
Harsha: Thatwouldbegreat.
Dave: We'reoutoftimeontheshow,butIwanttoaskyouthequestionI'veaskedeveryguestontheshowexceptepisodeseventy-something,whereIforgotonetime.Notenoughcoffeethatday,obviously.Ifsomeonecametoyoutomorrow,Harsha,andtheysaid,"Look,IwanttoperformbetterateverysinglethingIdoinlife.WhatarethethreemostimportantthingsIneedtoknow?"Whatwouldtellthem?
Harsha: Ohmygod.Iwouldn'tevenknowhowtoanswerthat.Themostimportantthing,obviously,istounderstandhoweverythinginthebodyworks.Firstofall,getwhatthebaselevelis,howthepharmacokineticsofsomethingactuallyis.Onceyouunderstandthat,youcanstartimprovinguponit.First,understandthebaseline,andthenunderstandwhatthemarkersaretoevengetstartedontheprocessofimprovingthem,whateveritmaybe.Ialwaysgobacktobiology,thebody,andthat'swhatI'mtalkingabout,butanything,really.Ifyouwanttoimproveuponsomething,firstdecidewhatthebaselevelisthatyou'reat,whatarethedifferentmarkersyouhavetomeasuretoknowifyou'redoingbetterorworse,andthengetastrategyinplaceandgoaheadandachieveit.
Dave: Allright,thatwasone.
Harsha: Oh,okaygreat,thankyou.I'mgoingtosticktoone.Idon'tknow,it'sjustavery,veryopenanswer.AllIcansayisonethingthat'sdefinitelyworkedformeiscomplete,unwaveringfocus,andIliketocompareittoahorsewithblinders.Knowwhatyourgoalisandkeepgoingtowardsit.Opportunitiesarealwayscomingalong.Ignorethem,becauseifyoukeepjumpingtoopportunities,younevergetyourgoalintoplace.Also,ifyou'relookingatopportunities,youareletting,again,natureorthemacro-environmentkindoftellyouwhattodo,whereasifyoualreadyhaveagoalandyou'regoingtogoafterthat,nomatterwhat,you'recreatingyourownopportunity.
Dave: Beautiful.Thatwastwo.I'menjoyingthis.
Harsha: Youknowwhat?Benaïveandstupid.Beverynaïveintothinkingthatyoucanactuallyachievesomethingrealinthisworld.Asyougodownthepath,youwillrealizehowmuchmoredifficultitis,butthefactthatyou'restartedandyou'realreadyintoitjustmakesitharderforyoutoretreat.
Dave: Gotit.Alittlebitofstrategicnaiveteisagoodthing.
Harsha: I'vedefinitelyansweredthisquestioninthemostunelegant,non-directwaypossible.
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Dave: Ithinkyoudidreallywell.FirstyoudidtheMBAanswer,whichisdefinesomething,measureyourgoals.Thatwasthesmartkindofthing.Thenyou'relikeyou'vegothavefocus.Allright,that'sagoodanswerthere.ThethirdoneisananswerIhaven'theardbefore,butit'sagoodone.Justbealittlebit-
Harsha: Naïveandarrogant.
Dave: Yousaidstupidandnaïve,butyoumeantalmostjustlikewillingtodosomethingbig,somethingthatnoonethinksispossible,whichactuallyisn'tstupid.It'scourageous,thewayIseeit.
Harsha: To-mah-to,tomato,potato,po-tah-to.Yeah,Icallitarrogance,youcallitconfidence,butitallendsbeingthesamethingattheendoftheday.It'sjustalabel.
Dave: OneofmyfavoriteguysontheplanetisPeterDiamandis.I'mfortunatetobefriendswithhimandtogetoccasionaltimetojusthangoutandtalk,andthisisaguywho'slike,"Yeah,privatespacetravel,weshoulddothat.Yeah,miningasteroids,weshoulddothat."Dude,that'ssocool!Samething,peoplethoughthewasnutsfortenyears,andnowhe'sdoingit.
Harsha: That'samazing.
Dave: Thatsortofthing,itisrequiredtodothebigdisruptions,sokudosforyouranswer.Thankyou.
Harsha: Thankyouverymuchforthat.
Dave: Forlistenerswhowanttolearnmoreaboutwhatyou'redoing,isthereanywherebesidesGoogleforNTXthattheyshouldgo?
Harsha: AllIcansayisfollowvery,verycloselythehealthpetitionthat'sgoingtobefiledinDConApril13th.Thepetition,weintendtocompletelyputitallonthetablewherewetalkaboutexactlyhowNTXworksonthebody,thebenefitsofit,etcetera.I'mtoldthatthepetitionwe'refilingisgoingtobeonefeetthick,andit'sgoingtobeapressconference.Everyone'sgoingtobethere.Ifyoufollowit,Ibelieveyouwouldhaveaccesstoenoughscienceoutthere.
Dave: BesuretosendmealinktothatwhenthepetitiongoesoutandI'llputituponsocialmedia,becauseIthinkBulletproofRadiolistenersandpeoplewhofollowusonFacebookandInstagramandeverywhereelse,they'llbegenuinelyinterestedinthissortofthingandtheabilityforanycompanyoranypersontotalkaboutscienceinthecontextofwhattheydoforaliving.Ithinkit'smeaningful,andIwishyouluckinyourworkthere.That'sreallycool.
Harsha: Thanksalot,Dave.Alwaysgoodtohearsomeonewhoisaprotagonistoftechnologicalevolution.Hey,attheendoftheday,evolutionalwayswins,soit'sahurdlewe'llgetover.
Dave: Itdoesindeed.ThanksHarsha.Haveabeautifulday.
Harsha: Thankyousomuch.Youtoo.Bye-bye.
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Dave: Ifyouenjoyedtoday'sepisode,youknowwhattodo.HeadonovertoBulletproof.comandresubscribeforyourBulletproofCoffeepacket,orgoonovertoiTunesandsay,"Hey,Ienjoyedthisshowalot,"andsendittoafriendorgiveusagoodrating.Dosomethingtogiveback.Itotallyappreciatethat.Whileyou'reatit,ifyou'regoingtodrink,headonovertoGoogleandlookaround,andseewhereyoucanfindalcoholthatcontainsNTX,whichisthisnewingredientthatcouldmakethealcoholabetterchoicethanplainalcohol.We'llalsoincludelinkstoallthisstuffinthetranscriptshere,andI'dalsoencourageyoutolookattheBulletproofAlcoholRoadmap.It'sentirelyfree.Youcandownloadit,andittalksaboutalcoholsthatarelowerintoxinsandhigherintoxins,andthingsyoucandotomitigatetheeffects.IthinkI'llhavetoupgradethatstufftotalkaboutNTX.
Haveanawesomeday.