ARAB NEWS Saturday, July 4, 2020 3

Spotlight

statements on television and in the media with great interest. They are in favor of a strength-ened democratic parliamentary system. And they are in favor of freedom of expression. They are in favor of freedom of press. They are also in favor of judicial independence.

If we can come together within the framework of these principles, it would be a gain for Turkey. It would be a gain for the future of Turkey. As I have just said, if we could crown our republic with a real democracy in its centennial, this heritage will reveal a very beautiful legacy to leave for their children for all who have contributed with a stone or a brick.

Q President Erdogan recently held an-

other tripartite meeting regarding Syria with Russia’s President (Vladimir) Putin and Iran’s (President) Has-san Rouhani. How has

the Turkish anti-Russian stance in Libya affected

the course of Turk-ish-Russian

ments and trolls against the CHP and (Erdogan’s govern-ing) Justice and Development Party (AKP). What kind of an arrangement could prevent these?

A First of all, we are against trolls. But it is the AKP who

brought trolls to Turkey’s agenda. Mr. Mahir (Unal) started the “green dot” social-media campaign, allowing us to see all the trolling within the AKP, and it was as if they revealed their secret in this regard.

Those who have paved the way for trolling

and then began to complain of them should hold themselves accountable for their action and admit their mistake — there should be a code of ethics.

There are also double standards here. If defamatory posts target the authorities, the most severe punishments are inflicted. The homes of those who write these things get raided at night, and they get detained and thrown into prison. After a period of

INTERVIEW

Kilicdaroglu: ‘A de-facto civilian coup is happening in Turkey’

Arab News Ankara

Kemal Kilicdaroglu, the leader of Turkey’s main opposition Republican People’s Party (CHP) since 2010, entered parliament as a deputy from Istanbul in 2002.

Described as the founding party of modern Turkey, the CHP, which espouses secularism, pro-Europeanism, and liberal democracy, contested the 2018 general election as part of a four-party Nation Alliance. Kilicdaroglu was recently interviewed by Benan Kepsutlu of the Indepen-dent Turkish at the party’s headquarters in Ankara on a wide range of topics.

QWith the abuses directed at (President Recep

Tayyip Erdogan’s son-in-law and Turkish Minister of Treasury and Finance) Berat Albayrak and his wife Esra on social media, the trial of (CHP politician) Canan Kaftancioglu for a tweet she posted seven years ago, and the targeting of (jailed opposition HDP MP) Selahattin Demirtas’ wife on social media, the issue of so-cial media in Turkey has taken on a completely different dimension. Is it necessary to introduce amendments to the laws regulating social media?

A First of all, liberal systems should not be bothered by

the media because the media, on behalf of the public, keeps a check on the rulers. If they make mistakes, the media takes note of them, and if they accomplish something, the media of course also takes note of them.

The media has the ability to monitor the performance of official authorities and correct their course, and this is why the media is referred to as the Fourth Estate in democratic systems.

As for authoritarian regimes, they are annoyed by this monitoring, so they seek to silence the media. Turkey today faces this kind of truth, which has been known to us.

Now, Erdogan’s statement about social media was exactly the following: “We want these social media platforms completely shut down or controlled.” This was later deleted.

What Erdogan wants to say through “shut down” or “controlled,” and what his thoughts say, is that: ‘If these websites praise me and talk about my accomplishments, I will leave them alone, as in the case of the channels loyal to me. But if they criticize me for my unfair decisions, I will have to control them.’

Q If an amendment were made to laws regulating

the use of social media, what are these laws’ boundaries? We encounter libelous state-

up to three or six months, they get released by the court. But if the defamatory posts target the opposition, the writers face no detention. We file a complaint, and the case gets lost in the corridors of the judiciary.

Q There is considerable interest in the speech you

will give at the general con-ference. An article recently published in the Cumhuriyet newspaper was viewed as the party’s manifesto. What are the issues you intend to em-phasize?

AWe started a multi-party system in 1946, and in that

period, there were coups, and prices were paid. After the coup attempt of July 15, 2016, a state of emergency was declared on July 20. A de-facto civilian coup is happening in Turkey at the moment. We know this.

There is pressure on the media, pressure on the judiciary, and pressure on parliament. In other words, institutions of the state that should have been independent are being held in custody in a sense.

Q There is talk of the Na-tion Alliance expanding

to include the Democracy and Progress Party (DEVA) and the Future Party, if they want. There are rumors about inclu-

When CHP regains power, everyone will live peacefully, express their thoughts freely, says main opposition party chief

Main, CHP leader Kemal Kilicdaroglu. Shutterstock Right, a demonstrator holds a picture of HDP lawmaker Leyla Guven. AFP Bottom, former Turkish prime minister and Future Party chairman, Ahmet Davutoglu. AFP Bottom left, Ali Babacan, former Turkish minister and erstwhile ally to President Erdogan. AFP

cooperation on Syrian issues?

A I am not justifying Turkey’s clash with the Russian

military or any other force, neither in Libya nor in Syria. In my opinion, rationality should prevail in foreign relations. Countries may have their own interests.

Turkey, Russia, Iran, and the US have interests in Libya and Syria, while we have kinship, historical, and cultural relations in the Middle East.

Q Let’s discuss your posi-tion on the consequences

of Turkish anti-Russian mea-sures taken in Libya for its co-

operation with Russia in Syria.

A I expect that common sense will prevail in both Russia

and Turkey, because conflict is not in the best interest of either of them, therefore they can reach a consensus, and there is a great importance attached to this consensus in Libya as well. The tribal conflict there harms Libyan interests. It is imperative for Libya to exercise its free will in this matter.

Q In conclusion, I would like to discuss two issues. The

first is the controversy over the planned conversion of the Hagia Sophia in Istanbul from a museum into a mosque.

AWell, Hagia Sophia is already a place of worship and has an

official imam. So, it actually is not completely closed for worship.

It is characterized as a world cultural landmark, and this should be recognized. It is internationalized in domestic politics from time to time. We do not wish to exploit religious features in internal politics. I find no logic in amplifying the matter and escalating it to the international stage.

Q Is there anything that you would like to add?

APressures should never drive a society into despair. The

victory that we achieved in the local elections will continue in the upcoming elections. We will crown our beautiful republic and our country with democracy.

Everyone will live peacefully in this country. Everyone will express their thoughts freely in this country. No investigation will be opened against anyone for expressing thoughts freely.

We will completely release parliament and the judiciary from custody. The judiciary will take decisions independently, according to the universal principles of law. The people, not the leaders of the political parties, will elect the parliamentarians.

@BenanKepsutlu

sion of those who could work in harmony with Ali Babacan, founder and leader of the DEVA. Is that a sign that the Nation Alliance will be ex-panded?

AWe had an alliance in the last elections the basis of

which was democracy, human rights, freedom of thought, and freedom of press — more or less, all the components of democratic standards.

We want to realize all these (goals) in Turkey. Consequently, an alliance has emerged naturally. We called it the Nation Alliance. Will this alliance grow or expand? It is of course our desire for it to expand.

QWould you like to see Ali Babacan and Ahmet Da-

vutoglu (former Turkish PM) under the roof of the Nation Alliance?

AThese two valuable leaders will make

the decisions on that matter. Naturally, I have been watching their

YouTube, Twitter, and Netflix do not suit this nation. We want

to control them by bringing a bill to parliament as soon as possible.

Recep Tayyip ErdoganPresident of Turkey