70
Fraud – What it Means to You HFMA Great Lakes Chapter February 16, 2018 1

Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

  • Upload
    others

  • View
    1

  • Download
    0

Embed Size (px)

Citation preview

Page 1: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Fraud – What it Means to YouHFMA Great Lakes Chapter

February 16, 2018

1

Page 2: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Who Are We?

2

Page 3: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Who Are We?

3

Benford’s Law

Page 4: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Amanda Fletcher, CPA, CFE, Manager

Kyle Sutton, CPA, CFE, Senior Consultant

We are members of Plante Moran’s Forensic Investigative Services Group. We have worked on expense reviews, asset misappropriation investigations, internal control assessments, and insurance claims. We have participated in interviews, performed financial analyses, conducted investigative research, and reviewed accounting records. We have also analyzed data to discover trends in expenses and detect fraud and have received extensive training in data analytics software.

4

Who Are We?

Page 5: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

5

CASESTUDIES

RECENT TRENDSPREVENTATIVE/

DETECTIVE METHODS

Q&A

Page 6: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

6

Check Tampering

Page 7: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

7

Check Tampering

Page 8: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Preventative Measures• Have independent individual(s) reviewing checks• Restrict access to check stock, signature stamps, etc.• Utilize Positive Pay

Detective Measures (Data Analytics Testing)• Evaluate sequence of cleared check numbers• Compare cancelled checks to check registers• Search for duplicate check numbers• Search for multiple checks to the same vendor on the same day• Search for “off” invoice numbers

8

Check TamperingWhat can you do?

Page 9: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

9

ACFE Report to the Nations

Page 10: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

10

Every two years the Association of Certified Fraud Examiners publishes a

study on occupational fraud and abuse.

The report is available for free at www.acfe.com

ACFE Report to the Nations

Page 11: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

ACFE Report to the Nations

2010 2012 2014 2016

Annual Revenues lost to Fraud

5%

Median Loss per Incident $160,000 $140,000 $145,000 $150,000

Primary Factor of Loss Lack of internal controls

Typical Scheme Time Duration

18 months

Clean Employment Histories

85% 87% 87% 95%

Typical Occurrences of Fraud

Asset misappropriation

Percentage of AssetMisappropriation

90% 87% 85% 83%

11

Summary of Trends

Page 12: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

12

ACFE Report to the NationsOccupational Fraud by Industry

What industry had the most occurrences of fraud?

A) GovernmentalB) ManufacturingC) HealthcareD) Banking/Financial

Page 13: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

13

ACFE Report to the NationsOccupational Fraud by Industry

Page 14: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

14

Fraud Schemes by IndustryACFE Report to the Nations

Page 15: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

15

DiscoveryACFE Report to the Nations

What is the most common method of identifying fraud?

A) TipB) Internal AuditC) External AuditD) Account Reconciliation

Page 16: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

16

DiscoveryACFE Report to the Nations

Page 17: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

17

DiscoveryACFE Report to the Nations

Page 18: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

• Median loss: Male - $187,000 Female - $100,000 (previously

$83,000)

• Between 35 and 41 years old 55 percent

• Long-term employees = larger frauds

• May not take vacation/PTO

18

ACFE Report to the NationsThe Typical Fraudster

Page 19: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

19

Behavioral Red FlagsACFE Report to the Nations

What was the most common behavioral red flag displayed by fraudsters?

A) Addiction ProblemsB) Living Beyond Their Means/Financial DifficultiesC) Complained About Inadequate PayD) Marital Problems

Page 20: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

20

Behavioral Red FlagsACFE Report to the Nations

Page 21: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

21

Impact of CollusionACFE Report to the Nations

Page 22: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Reimbursement Scheme

22

Page 23: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

23

• Anonymous tip to the Board regarding improper credit card spending by the CEO.

• Board performed a preliminary investigation and found evidence to substantiated the claim.

• We were engaged to investigate: Credit card spending; Related party payments; and Expense reimbursements.

The SituationReimbursement Scheme

Page 24: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

24

Reimbursement Scheme

Page 25: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

25

Preventative Measures• Properly segregate duties• Ensure reviewing/approving expenses process is appropriate Subordinate should not be reviewing supervisor’s expenses Reviewer should be able to differentiate a legitimate expense from an improper

expense

• Pay attention to statement balances, not just individual transactions.

Detective Measures (Data Analytics Testing)• Search for duplicate transactions (amount, location, date, people, etc.).• Search for transactions just below documentation requirement threshold.

Reimbursement SchemeWhat can you do?

Page 26: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

26

Reimbursement SchemeRelated Party Research

CEO

Page 27: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

27

Are You Insured?

Page 28: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Situation• Loan officer would increase

customer loan balances

• Loan officer would write check to a different bank and deposit the check in a personal account

28

Are You Insured?

Page 29: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

29

Are You Insured?

Preventative Measures• Segregation of duties

Detective Measures• Review “unusual” transactions ALL the way through the process

Case Results• Insurance recovery: $115K paid to customers for direct losses. $20K paid to customers for interest accrued.

• Check your insurance policy!

Page 30: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

30

Fraudulent Credit Card Sales

Page 31: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

31

Fraudulent Credit Card SalesSituation• Medical textbook/subscriptions organization was being hit with thousands

of dollars of purchases from stolen credit cards

• Wanted to know – Why?! Suspicions of a former employee exacting revenge Potential that one of their vendors wanted to increase sales, and therefore

purchases

Page 32: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

32

Fraudulent Credit Card SalesResults• Still being determined; however, no links to former employees or vendors

identified

Testing• Data Analytics Geocoding

Page 33: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

33

Address Geocoding

Page 34: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Geocoding: The process of transforming a postal address description to a location on the earth’s surface (spatial representation in numerical coordinates).

Forensic Data Analytics: Geocoding is a precise method for performing address matches (such as vendor-employee matches) or finding addresses within a close proximity.

34

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geocoding

What is geocoding?Address Geocoding

Page 35: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

35

Map of ResultsAddress Geocoding

Page 36: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

36

Excel Fuzzy Lookup MatchAddress Geocoding

• Add-in for Excel available on Microsoft’s website

• Useful for comparing data from two sources Address matching Name matching

• Simple to use

Page 37: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

37

Excel Fuzzy Lookup Match ResultsAddress Geocoding

Page 38: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

38

Detection Methods

Page 39: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

39

Detection Methods

• Surprise procedures

• Ask questions and get answers

• Anonymous hotline and/or cameras

• Forensic accountants

• Periodic data monitoring

Page 40: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Detection Methods

Definition – the process of analyzing many fields of data within databases to find correlations, patterns and anomalies.

Depending on the data and the source, examples include:

40

Periodic Data Monitoring

IDEA

Access

Excel

ACL

Tableau

Alteryx

Page 41: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Detection Methods

41

Periodic Data Monitoring

Checks on non-payroll days

Page 42: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

42

Beyond the Accounting Data

Page 43: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

43

• Allegations that the former Finance Director used the organization’s credit card for personal purposes.

• No paper documentation existed (all destroyed).

• The former Finance Director moved out of state (i.e., not available for interviews).

Beyond the Accounting Data

Page 44: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

44

Background research identified Finance Director’s daughter lived near Ft. Myers, FL

Beyond the Accounting Data

Page 45: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

45

Beyond the Accounting Data

Page 46: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

46

Beyond the Accounting Data

Page 47: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

47

Beyond the Accounting Data

Page 48: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

48

Beyond the Accounting Data

Takeaways:• Think about how you can use the information available when you are missing

the “ideal” information.

• You may not be able to see the answer using only one source of data; use multiple sources of information to piece together the puzzle.

Page 49: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

49

Billing and Corruption

Page 50: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

50

• $1B+ entity• Internal service arm considered small at

$15M/year in expenses• Internal audit finally audited them …

Address 533…on Manta matched residence

of employee per Spokeo

Billing and Corruption

Page 51: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

51

Initial engagement:perform background

research on select personnel and

vendors.

Found connections with multiple

vendors.

Billing and Corruption

Page 52: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

52

Email #1Senior Manager of the internal service arm

copied on a quote from one of their vendors (Vendor A) to another vendor (Vendor B).

Billing and Corruption Vendor A

Vendor B

Page 53: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

53

Email #2Senior Manager emails other

company employees to issue RFQ to Vendor B.

Email #3Employee emails Vendor B the

RFQ.

Billing and Corruption

Page 54: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

54

Email #4Senior Manager receives quote from

Vendor B.

Billing and Corruption

Page 55: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

55

• Quote from “original supplier” to vendor: $30,000

• Quote from vendor to company: $65,000

• Mark-up on transaction: $35,000

Billing and Corruption

Page 56: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

56

Billing and Corruption

Page 57: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

57

Total estimated loss from mark-up scheme:

Over $6 Million

Vendor Invoice TotalVendor 1 10,119,949.00$ Vendor 2 7,725,317.32 Vendor 3 7,220,706.32 Vendor 4 7,063,603.93 Vendor 5 4,506,756.93 Vendor 6 3,581,829.00 Vendor 7 3,506,255.35 Vendor 8 3,296,604.40 Vendor 9 2,353,896.95 Vendor 10 1,049,634.88 Vendor 11 741,366.00 Vendor 12 563,455.50

Top Paid Vendors Total Invoiced April 20, 2009 through June 30, 2016 Vendor 1Vendor 12 Vendor 2 Vendor 4

Billing and Corruption

Page 58: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

58

• Corruption can be VERY difficult to detect and even more difficult to prove. We needed to: Utilize our background research tools. Perform social media research. Perform an exhaustive review of email activity using key-word searches. Even surveillance was performed to supplement our findings.

• However, a simple Google search by internal audit was all it took to start unraveling the scheme.

• Follow-up if you see something that doesn’t make sense. Identifying that the quote from one vendor to another vendor seemed unusual and digging in further was key to piecing together the mark-up scheme.

Billing and Corruption

Page 59: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

59

What do you look for?• Missing information: Addresses Invoice numbers Logos

• Inconsistent information: Fonts Formats Addresses

• What is the business purpose? Ask ownership

• Confirm the legitimacy, not the existence• Think outside the box!

Billing and Corruption

Page 60: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

60

Dixon, IL

Page 61: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Dixon, IL

61

2013 Population – 15,333

2012 Median household income - $38,719

2012 Median house/condo value - $83,601

2012 Total expenses $15.6M

Page 62: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Dixon, IL

62

Long-term employee

Started as in intern in high-school in 1970

Named Treasurer and Comptroller in 1983

Lack of internal controls

Reconciled accounts

Made deposits

Requested funds

Controlled the mail (PO Box)

The Background

Page 63: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Dixon, IL

63

What’s Wrong?

Page 64: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Dixon, IL

64

What’s Wrong?

Page 65: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Dixon, IL

65

Real Invoice

Page 66: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Dixon, IL

66

The Scheme

Page 67: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Dixon, IL

67

How Much Did She Take?

Page 68: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Dixon, IL

68

How Much Did She Take?

Page 69: Fraud – What it Means to Yougreatlakeshfma.org/images/pdfs/200.pdf · 2018-02-23 · Fraud – What it Means to You. HFMA Great Lakes Chapter. February 16, 2018. 1

Dixon, IL

69

How Was She Caught?