assembly.nyandarua.go.keassembly.nyandarua.go.ke/download/motion/Nyandarua County... · Web viewThank you, I would like to propose an amendment on clause 5, I would like to insert

1

9TH JULY 2014

REPUBLIC OF KENYA

NYANDARUA COUNTY ASSEMBLY

1st ASSEMBLY-2nd SESSION

OFFICIAL HANSARD REPORT

The deputy Speaker on the chair

2.30 pm

PRAYERS

Speaker: Proceed with the business for today, the first order.

Clerk: Administration of oath

Speaker: Next order

Clerk: Communication from the chair

Speaker: Next order

Clerk: Messages

Disclaimer: The Electronic Version of the Hansard Report is for information purposes only. A certified copy of the Hansard Report can be obtained from the Hansard Editor.

2

Speaker: Next order

Clerk: Petitions

Speaker: Next order

Clerk: Papers

Speaker: Next order

Clerk: Notices of motion

Speaker: Next

Clerk: Statements.

Speaker: Next

Clerk: Progress report on the sports management by the committee on education, labour and

social services.

Speaker: Hon. Kamau

Hon. Kamau: Thank you Mr. Speaker. Bearing in mind the enormous task that the committee

had and the members of this Assembly can bear me witness since the whole session in the

morning was for my committee. We took the bill through all the stages. I seek leave to table the

same report on another day.

Speaker: Thank you hon. Kamau but remember that the matter that you are dealing with and

which you are supposed to give a progressive report is a matter of urgency. For that purpose I

wish to give the date of Tuesday


3

Hon. Kamau: Mr. Speaker if it is agreeable I would seek leave that we table it on Thursday 17th

July 2014 at 2.30 pm

Speaker: Okay it will be tabled on Thursday 17th July 2014 at 2.30 pm. Next order

Clerk: Tabling of the report on the Nyandarua County Flags, Symbols and Name Protection Bill

2014 by the committee on justice legal affairs and public service.

Speaker: Hon. Kagwe

Hon. Kagwe: Thank you Mr. Speaker, I rise to table the report by the committee on justice legal

affairs and public service on the Nyandarua County Flags, Symbols and Name Protection Bill

2014

Speaker: The report has been tabled well. Hon. Kagwe

Hon. Kagwe: I rise to seek leave that the bill be read for the second time.

Speaker: Hon. Kagwe it is prudent that you state the standing order.

(Hon. Kieru rises on a point of order.)

Speaker: Hon. Kieru

Hon. Kieru: I have an issue; the chairman for the legal committee has tabled the report, what is

the report for? A bill was tabled and it was subjected to a committee the committee is expected to

allow the bill to be taken through the stages of a bill. I wonder what the report is for since it will

not be debated and it will not be moved into a motion.


4

Speaker: We are still learning. There before we used to table the report, it was adopted and then

the bill was read for the second time but we have changed that practice. We used that the report

should be tabled and I be given three days for perusal and then the mover seek leave for the

second reading of the bill. The bill cannot be move for more than one stage. Hon. Kagwe seeks

leave of the house for the bill to be read for the second time.

Hon. Kagwe: I rise on the standing order 116 (1) with the leave of the assembly, not more than

one stage of a bill may be taken at one sitting.

Speaker: You are seeking leave of the house that the bill be read for the second time. The mover

having requested that the bill be read for a second time, then it should be read for a second time.

Hon. Kagwe: I rise to move a motion that the bill be read for a second time.

(Hon. Muchiri rises on a point of order)

Hon. Muchiri: I stand on a point of order 120, because this is a motion he is supposed to read

the title of this bill so that now you can proceed.

Speaker: Clerk

Hon. Muchiri: This is a motion and the clerk cannot move a motion in the house.

(Hon. Kieru rises on a point of order)

Hon. Kieru: On the standing order 116, except with the leave of the assembly, that should have

been the first motion. The assembly should give the leave and this is a motion so there should be

a question proposed by the Speaker that the hon. Member be allowed to take his bill to another

stage. The motion for the standing order 116 has not been moved. He has just said that he wants

to invoke that and it has not been determined by the house.


5

Speaker: I wish to call upon hon. Kagwe to first move a motion according to the standing order

116

Hon. Kagwe: Thank you Mr. Speaker sir, I understand that we are still learning. I wish to move

a motion under Standing Order to seek leave of the assembly for the bill to go for more than one

stage.

Hon. Muchiri: I second.

(Question proposed)

(Question put and agreed upon)

Speaker: The bill can go for more than one stage. Hon. Kagwe.

Hon. Kagwe: Guided by standing order 120 I rise to move a motion that the Nyandarua County

Flags, Symbols and Name Protection Bill2014 be read for the second time.

Speaker: Clerk

Clerk: The second reading of the Nyandarua County Flags, Symbols and Name Protection

Bill2014

(Question on the second reading of the bill proposed)

Hon. Kagwe: Thank you Mr. Speaker sir for giving me this chance to move the motion of the

Nyandarua County Flags, Symbols and Name Protection Bill 2014. Having gone through the bill,

of the Nyandarua County Flags, Symbols and Name Protection Bill 2014, we understand that

when the new constitution was being promulgated, Kenya got 47 counties and the government

was devolved and Nyandarua became a county. When we talk about the county flags, symbols


6

and name protection bill 2014, we are talking about our identity. When we as Nyandarua County

interact with other counties on development Activities, we need to be identified and this is one

way of identifying us.

(Hon. Kieru rises on appoint of order.)

Hon. Kieru: In as much as hon. Kagwe wants the bill to go through all the stages, I do not think

that he will be very successful because we are dealing with a very sensitive document. These will

be our symbols for the next God knows how many years. This is bill that is printed in black on a

yellow paper. He expects us to understand that the more dark color is black and the more lighter

it is I do not know which color it will be. We should be furnished with these things literally. For

example we should have the flag on our files. He has not supporting material for his bill for it to

go through to the next stage. I therefore move motion that this matter be deferred

Speaker: Hon. Kieru appreciate that the question has been proposed and you are at liberty to go

on nay.

Hon. Kieru: By then it will be too late because the ayes might win and I did not see which flag it

is.

(Hon. Ngotho rises on point of information)

Hon. Ngotho: If hon. Kieru would be genuine enough he can remember that the flag and the

symbols were presented in a Kamukunji and we were asked whether we had any change that we

would have wanted to propose before they publish the bill. He was consulted unless he has

changed his mind. He should tell us that he has changed his mind because he was the one

contributing most; in fact he was the expert of the day.

(Hon Kirumba on a point of information)


7

Speaker: Do you need that information?

Hon. Kieru: Yes I do

Hon. Kirumba: It is fair to appreciate that hon. Kieru has had so many motions so he is likely to

have forgotten what could have happened but he was very vocal. I think know he can recall the

true position.

Speaker: Hon. Gachari

Hon. Gachari: I am rising on a point of information. Hon. Kieru is aware that we went for the

public participation and we went with the flag and it was recommend by people and what we are

seeing here is paper because we cannot carry the flag to bring it to the assembly. What we are

supposed to show him is how the public recommended. I thought that was the argument.

Hon. Kieru: I want to be clearly understood. I am for the county symbols but my argument is

this, we are a legislative house that will go into history for having passed the first county

symbols. This committee went to the public and they carried the symbols and showed the public

what they meant. What is the mistake of having the county symbols here in the files or in the

assembly as we debate?

(Hon Kirumba rise on a point of order)

Hon. Kirumba: Mr. Speaker I would rather cite the standing order 121 and if we read that we

shall appreciate that a bill having been read for the second time stands committed to the

committee of the whole house. If I remember well I think we have already done that.

Speaker: The flag cannot be brought to this house and that is why we went for a Kamukunji and

everything was displayed there. Hon. Kieru you contribute much and he should appreciate that


8

the question has already been proposed and he should wait for the question to be put. If you do

not want this motion to be moved then you are in a position to lobby and ensure that nay

succeeds. Proceed hon. Kagwe.

Hon. Kagwe: Thank you Mr. Speaker. Hon. Kieru is just jogging the members’ minds. I was

saying that the county symbols are very important since they are the ones that will give us the

county identity. Once the governor flies that flag he or she will be identified as the governor

from Nyandarua. As we went for the public participation we appreciate that there is a lot to be

desired, they do not understand what the county symbols are for. Therefore there is great need

for civic education and it must be given priority so that by the time that this house will be giving

other bills then the public will be able to participate. The bill is self-explanatory and I call hon.

Muchiri to second.

Hon. Muchiri: Thank you Mr. Speaker and I rise to second the motion. This is a very important

document and I remember in the morning when we were deliberating on the issues of bursary,

we were concerned that the symbols should appear in the bursary forms. This bill has come at the

right time and because it is the identity of the county I give the members to support the motion so

that we can finalize and start operating with our identity. I know that we shall go through the bill

clause by clause and look at it critically. I second.

Speaker: I had proposed the question when the member was seeking leave of the house that the

bill be taken through more than one stage in one sitting.

(Question proposed)


9

Hon. Kieru: I support the bill be read for the second time. I do not want to raise my issues here

but I will raise them later when we shall be in the committee of the whole house and I call upon

the mover to respond.

Hon. Kagwe: I would like to thank all the members for support this motion and I beg to move

(Question put and agreed upon.)

Speaker: Once the bill has been read for the second time it will be committed to the committee

of the whole house under Standing Order 121 (2)

(The deputy Speaker leaves the Speaker’s chair and hon. Kirumba takes the chair at the

committee of the whole house)

Chairperson: Hon. Members we are now in the committee of the whole house and we shall go

clause by clause. We shall start with clause four. Clerk

Clerk: Clause 4.County symbols declared. Section 4(1) The flag of which the design and

description is set out in Part I of the First Schedule to this Act is hereby declared to be the county

flag.

(2) The seal of which the design out in Part II of the First Schedule to this Act is hereby declared

to be the Public Seal of the county.

(3)The emblem which out in Part III of the First Schedule to this Act is hereby declared to be the

emblem of the county

(4) The motto the content of which is embedded in part IV of the First Schedule of this Act is

hereby declared to be the motto of the County.


10

(Question on clause 4 proposed)

Chairperson: Hon. Kieru

Hon. Kieru: This is technical and I would wish that the Speaker chips in on clause 4 (1) the flag

of which the design and description are set out in part I of the First Schedule to this Act is hereby

declared to be the county flag. At this juncture if we endorse clause 4 (1) (2) (3) and (4) then the

relevance of checking the part I in the First Schedule could be null and void because if we say

that clause 4 (1) becomes part of the bill then automatically the flag suggested will be the county

flag. I would propose that we start at clause 5 and when we finish with all the other clauses then

we can go back to clause four

Chairperson: You sentiments are very clear. This morning you had to remember that we had to

interchange some of the clauses. If we put the question on clause 4(1) it is like we shall seal

everything should there arise some amendments. The best way to go about is as proposed and

that is one route. The other route is to do the amendment so that clause 4(1) so that we can go

through all the clauses and then where we have no issue we slot it in.

Hon. Kagwe: I support the sentiment of a fellow hon member because if we go through clause 4

we shall be giving no relevance to all the other clauses. It is better we start with 5 and then we

come to 4 later.

Chairperson: Thank you, I think that is the way to go. Hon. Muchiri

Hon. Muchiri: Chairperson I need to understand the sequence in which we are supposed to take

the bill in the committee of the whole house. Why should we first leave clause 4? We need to do


11

the necessary amendment of there is going to be an amendment because if we leave it, are we not

going to be contravening the way we take the business of the committee of the whole house.

Chairperson: Well heard and I would like to respond before I give another order. You will

notice that when you read clause 4 (1) the flag of which the design and description are set out in

part I of the First Schedule to this Act is hereby declared to be the county flag. The concern of

hon. Kieru is the last word of the clause. It will seem like we have already sealed the deal. To

avoid any problem, we thought we should do it later. If we endorse it is will be like we are

sealing any leeway of any amendment. We are avoiding any thorny area where a person may say

that whatever we did after that was completely out of order. Hon. Kieru.

Hon. Kieru: Thank you. Hon. Muchiri raised a valid point of order and I agree that there is the

procedure to be followed in standing order 122. That is the order that the bill should follow in the

committee of the whole house. You have explained that and it was my concern if we endorse

clause 4 then the references they are referring to that the part I of the first schedule, then when

that time come to move into them it will be irrelevant.

(Hon. King’ori rises on a point of order)

Speaker: What is the point of order?

Hon. King’ori: Hon. Kieru is not out of order but I would like you to go through the standing

order 124 (10) the consideration of any part of the clause of a bill may be postponed until such

later stage of the proceedings in the committee on such bill at the committee may determine.

Chairperson: I said that those were the options because we had either to suspend it and bringing

it later and we were saying there is also another route so that it would appear after we have


12

finished that is in the numbering so that we would not seem like we have cleared the bill by

endorsing clause 4 and we had not gone through the bill. Let us leave clause 4 and the chairman

should note so that he will know when to come in. Members we should proceed to clause 5

Clerk: Clause 5.Insulting county symbols declared an offence.

Any person who shows disrespect in speech manner or in writing, to the county symbols or any

representation thereof, shall upon conviction be guilty of an offence and shall be liable to

imposition of a fine not exceeding thirty thousand shillings or to imprisonment for a term not

exceeding six months or both.


(Question on clause 5 put and agreed upon.)

Clerk: Clause 6 Prohibition of improper use of the county symbols 6(1) Notwithstanding

anything contained in any law for the time being in force, a person shall not, expect with the

written permission of the Executive Committee Member;

(a) Use any county symbol, or any colourable imitation thereof, in furtherance of, or display

the same as advertisement for, any trade, business, calling or profession; or

(b) Use any specific county symbol or any colourful imitation thereof, in the title of any

patent, or any trade mark designed or design; or

(c) Manufacture, export or import any article or goods on which any title, trademark or

design is used in contravention of paragraph (b) of this subsection,


13

(2) (1) (a) of this section relating to the use of specified county symbols shall not apply to the

publication of a bona fide news item (whatever is in a newspaper or any other medium) or to the

publication in a newspaper of any article connected with bona fide news items other than a news

item in furtherance of, or as advertisement for, any trade, business, calling or profession and or in

furtherance of any Acts of patriotism that will promote county and national cohesion.

(3) Any permission given under subsection (1) of this section may be given subject to such

conditions as the Executive Committee Member may deem fit.

(4) Any person who contravenes the provision of this section shall upon conviction be guilty of

an offence and is liable to a fine not exceeding thirty thousand shillings or to imprisonment for a

term not exceeding six months or both.

Chairperson: Yes chairperson

Hon. Kagwe: Thank you, I would like to propose an amendment on clause 5, I would like to

insert the word sign between the word manner and the word or. So that it reads any person who

shows disrespect, in speech, manner sign or writing,

Chairperson: Hon. Kagwe I had proposed the question and put the question and you never rose

to make any amendment and you know what that means. Have the list of amendments so that we

do not put the question and then we reverse. If there was any amendment to clause 5 it should

have come before I put the question but I will use discretion but that is not the way to go. Make

that amendment.


14

Hon. Kagwe: Thank you and apologize for that. I seek to move a motion of amendment on

clause 5 insert the word sign between the word manner and the word or. I call upon hon. Kieru to

second

Hon. Kieru: I second but with an amendment. I agree with the first amendment. It should read

any person who shows disrespect, in speech, manner, sign or writing, there should be a comma

between the words manner and sign.

(Question on clause 5 with the amendment proposed)

(Question on clause 5 with the amendment put and agreed upon)

Chairperson: Let us go back to where we were before we were brought back.

(Question on clause 6 is proposed)


Clerk: 7 prohibition of display of county symbols. Section 7(1) any person shall not:-

(a) Without lawful authority, alter the county symbol.

(b) In or within view of any public place, use, display, destroy, or damage the county

symbols in any manner with the intention of dishonoring it.

(2)Any person who contravenes subsection (1) of this section shall be guilty of an offense upon

conviction and shall be liable to a fine not exceeding thirty thousand shillings or to an

imprisonment for a term not exceeding six months or both.



15

Chairperson: Yes hon. Kieru

Hon. Kieru: I want the chairperson to tell us the lawful authority in clause 7 (1) (a). It is good

that we know the source of authority it should be clear. The chairman should specify.

Chairperson: The sentiments are well taken. The chairman should clarify so that we do not pass

something that we see that it needs clarification.

Hon. Kagwe: Thank you. I think that the executive committee member for justice legal and

public service is the custodian of the bill so he gives authority through a regulation with approval

of this house.

Chairperson: Okay I note that there is an amendment touching on something there.

Hon. Kagwe: There was an oversight there and I would like to move a motion of amendment on

clause 7 (1) (a) to insert the words ‘the executive committee member’ between the words

‘authority and alter’ and then add the words with approval of the ‘County Assembly’ at the end

of the same sentence. I call hon. Kieru to second

Hon. Kieru: I second the amendment.

Chairperson: I am consulting with the clerk and I am aware that if we make the amendment we

may change the impact of that and that is why we engaged lawyers. This will also be captured

under the regulations; that is clause 13. Your concerns will be catered for under clause 13

subsections 1 (a) to (h)

(Question on clause 7 put)



16

Chairperson: Yes hon. kieru

Hon. Kieru: A motion has been moved and seconded what is the procedure

(Hon King’ori rises on a point of order)

Hon. King’ori: A member cannot rise when a question is being put. He can only challenge when

the question was proposed.

Chairperson: Was you amendment seconded?

Hon. Kagwe: Yes it was.



Clerk: Clause 8 (1) officials authorized to fly the county flag. Section 8(1) for avoidance of

doubt, the following persons shall fly the county flag.

(a) The Governor;

(b) The Deputy Governor;

(c) The Senator

(d) The Speaker of the county assembly

(e) The executive committee members

(2) The Executive Committee Member shall prescribe who and in which manner in which the

County Flag may be flown or displayed.


17

(Question proposed)


Clerk: Clause 9

9 (1) Hoisting the County flag. Section 9(1) Subject to this Act, the County flag shall be hoisted

on the following occasions:-

(a) At all official functions attended by the Governor, the Deputy Governor, the Senator, the

Speaker or Executive Committee Member;

(b) At the headquarters of the county government;

(c) At the county assembly

(d) At the head offices of the sub counties, wards and villages;

(e) All educational institutions within the county;

(f) All citizen service centers.

(2) The Executive Committee Member may prescribe such other place where the county flag

shall be hoisted or displayed and by whom.

Chairperson: Yes chair

Hon. Kagwe: I would like to move and amendment on …


Hon. Kieru: Mr. Chair you have not even proposed the question.


18

Chairperson: I beg your pardon


Hon. Kagwe: I wish to move an amendment on clause 9 (1) (e) that reads ‘All educational

institutions within the county’ I propose that we delete that clause.

Chairperson: Are you saying that you do not want the county flag to be hoisted all educational

institutions within the county?

Hon. Kagwe: Yes Mr. Chair. We know that the education institutions that were devolved to the

county are the ECDs and the poly techniques. We also understand that most of the ECDs are

based in the existing primary schools that hoist the national flag and I do not see the reason why

we should hoist a county flags in an ECD center within a primary school. There will be a conflict

of interest. We felt as committee that as much as they are devolved, there was no reason for

hoisting two flags at the same time. That is why as committee we saw that we are not supposed

to hoist a county flag in all the education institutions in the county.

Chairperson: Those are the sentiments of the committee and I want to get your contributions.

Hon. Kieru: Since I am standing to oppose the amendment, I think that is should first be

seconded.

Chairperson: I gave you a chance thinking that you were rising up to second and I beg your

pardon. Who is seconding your motion chair?

Hon. Kagwe: I call upon hon. Mwichigi to second.

Hon. Mwichigi: As a committee we agreed that 9 (1) (e) should be wholly deleted. I second.


19

(Question on amendment proposed.)

Chairperson: Hon. Kieru:

Hon. Kieru: I want us to reason together. These are the institutions within the county but are

under the management of the national government. However in the curriculum of the secondary

and the primary schools we know they have the county government and they are learning about

the county government and devolution. How then can such a mark miss in an institution ye they

belong to the county? The education in primary and secondary school is confined in Kenya in the

Kenyan education system. Whatever is happening in Nyandarua is happening in Murang’a and

the people in Nyandarua are entitled to know this symbol. Where else will they know that they

have a county government that has the executive and legislature? This brings a concept that I had

thought about. This is a government that has county symbols why then don’t we have the county

anthem? This will come under the new clauses but I support that the clause that all educational

institutions within the county to hoist the flag so that the people we have can be able to

understand the concepts of devolution.

Chairperson: Hon. Kagiri

Hon. Kagiri: Thank you chair. I am rising to support the deletion of that. I am looking into a

scenario that in a primary school we have two flags and we sing the national anthem and then we

sing the county anthem. The symbol of unity in this country is the national flag. I think it is

appropriate that we do not waste time hoisting two flags.



20

Hon. Kieru: There are some places that those flags will be hoisted, for example here; it means

that we adore the county of Nyandarua and our country as well. Is he contradicting himself by

saying that it would be a mistake to hoist both flags in the educational institutions while we hoist

two here?

Chairperson: Point taken

Hon. Kagiri: I think the honorable member did not get what I was saying. This is a different

entity all together. In that section there is a subsection that says even in the village offices. We

have so many villages for example in Githoiro they are 5, the leaners can be able to know their

symbols by looking at them from the villages.




Chairperson: On what point of order are you raising on?

Hon. Kieru: It is not a point of order but I am raising a concern on clause 9. There is something

tricky about it. That is 9 (1) (a) At all official functions attended by the Governor, the Deputy

Governor, the Senator, the Speaker or Executive Committee Member: I have a problem with ‘or’

because it brings an alternative. In my opinion it should be ‘the Speaker and Executive

Committee Members’

Chairperson: In my response you will see that we have already cleared section 8 and there is a

correlation between clause 8 and 9


21

(Hon. King’ori rises on a point of order.)

Chairperson: Yes

Hon. King’ori: If you go standing order 134 (2) at any time before the certification and

submission of a bill to the governor, the Speaker may correct formal errors or oversight therein

without changing the substance of the bill. I am saying that whatever hon. Kieru is saying is

valid and because we already passed the clause and that is an error that he is talking about then

under that standing order the Speaker has that authority to change that error before the assenting

of the bill.

Chairperson: You have said what I had said and all that you have added is the standing order.

What we are saying is that if we had passed anything and the substance will not change ten the

standing order 134 will apply. What hon. Kieru was trying to say is that all official functions

attended by them the flag must be raised

Hon. Kieru: Let me make it clear. I agree with the deputy Speaker but actually it says the

‘Speaker may’ he may not see an error. I want you to get me clear. It says ‘At all official

functions attended by the Governor, the Deputy Governor, the Senator, the Speaker or Executive

Committee Member: what does ‘or’ mean? It means that the flag could be hoisted in the

occasion of the Governor, the Deputy Governor, the Senator, the Speaker or when they are

together and then it says ‘or the Executive Committee Member.’ You have brought together the

Governor, the Deputy Governor, the Senator and the Speaker and the second option is when the

executive members are there. Should it be ‘the Governor, the Deputy Governor, the Senator, the

Speaker and Executive Committee Member: I propose that we delete ‘or’ and put ‘and’.

(Hon. Mwichigi rises on a point of order.)


22

Chairperson: What is that point of order?

Hon. Mwichigi: I am standing on the standing order 124 (2) No amendment shall be moved to

any part of a bill by any member, other than the member in charge of the bill, unless written

notification of the amendment shall have been given to the clerk twenty four hours before he

commencement of the siting at which that part of the bill is considered in the committee. That

means that the amendment that hon. Kieru is trying to bring in cannot be sustained.


Hon. Kieru: I did not move any amendment. I was asking the chairman what that means and if

there is a problem that he should move an amendment.

Chairperson: That is true, he did as he said neither did he call for anyone to second. He was

making the committee of the whole house to understand.

(Hon. King’ori takes the chair in the committee of the whole house)

Hon. Kagwe: Thank you chair let me take this opportunity to appreciate the sentiments of hon.

Kieru. When you state ‘or’ it means that for the executive committee member they can hoist and

some of the instances he may not. I move and amendment to clause 9 (1) (a) to delete the word

‘or’ that is the word between Speaker and the executive committee member, and replace it with

‘and’ and I call hon. Muchiri to second.

Hon. Muchiri: I second

(Question on amendment of clause 9(1) (a) proposed)

(Question on amendment of clause 9(1) (a) put and agreed upon)


23


(Hon. Kagwe rises)

Chairperson: Are you rising on a point of order?

Hon. Kagwe: I want to amend and I had risen before you put the question

Chairperson: Then you should rise on a point of order of amendment

Hon. Kagwe: I rise to amend clause 9 (1) (f) such that it be deleted from the bill. We as

committee we thought that it would not be good to have the flag in all citizen service centers

since we have them in the headquarters of the sub county offices, wards and villages. I call upon

hon. Kieru to second.

Hon. Kieru: I second

(Question on amendment of clause 9(1) (f) proposed)

(Question on amendment of clause 9(1) (f) put and agreed upon)

Clerk: Clause 10. Custodian of the county symbols. The Executive Committee Member shall be

the custodian of the county symbols protected by this Act.


(Question on clause 10 put and agreed upon)

Clerk: Clause 11 (1) The national flag as a symbol of unity and patriotism. Section 11(1The

county flag will be hoisted within the county together with the national flag and shall be used to


24

unite the people by creating visual, verbal, or iconic or representations of the national values and

goals in the county.

(2) To promote the objectives in the subsection (1) the Governor shall fly the national flag in the

prescribed official car or automobile within the country.


Hon. Kagwe: I rise to move an amendment on clause 11 (2). The committee felt that we delete

the word country and replace it with county. I call upon hon. Suleiman to second

Hon. Suleiman: I second.

(Question on amendment of clause 11(2) proposed)

(Question on amendment of clause 11 (2) put and agreed upon)



Hon. Kieru: I would like the chairman to tell us what is meant by clause 11 (1) The county flag

shall be hoisted within the county together with the national flag. The committee said the in all

the education institutions in the county, where we have the national flag, the county flag should

not be hoisted. Does it mean that where the national flag is hoisted the county flag shall be

hoisted or where the county flag is the national flag should be hoisted?

Chairperson: To my understanding is that the previous amendment accommodates this one. The

previous one is null and void and the previous one now is accommodated by this. We proceed.


25

This bill was crafted by the legal members of council who are experts in this and therefore let us

honor it.

Clerk: Clause 12 Power of amendment First Schedule. The Executive Committee Member may

with the approval of the County Executive Committee and County Assembly, by notice in the

county gazette, amend the First Schedule to this Act.



Clerk: Clause13 Regulations. Section 13 (1) The Executive Committee Member may make

regulations-

(a) Prescribing other occasions upon which, other persons by whom and the manner in which

the County Flag may be flown, lowered or displayed as the case maybe;

(b) The days and the times during which the County flag shall be flown;

(c) without detracting from the general design depicted in the First Schedule, the standard

sizes, dimensions, proportions, and colours of the County Flags for all or any purposes or in all

or any circumstances;

(d) The conduct and the etiquette to be followed in the flying orother use of the County Flag;

(e) Provision of funds to conduct of civic education and sensitize persons on use of the

county symbols and their value to promote county, intergovernmental and national cohesion and

patriotism.

(f) Prohibiting, controlling or restricting the use of any specified county symbol;


26

(g) Regulating the manner in which application may be made to the office of the Executive

Committee Member for permission under section 6 of this Act.

(h) Prescribing the form of any license by which such permission may be given and fixing

any fee for such application and license.


Hon. Kagwe: I beg to move an amendment on clause 13 (1) by inserting the words ‘with the

approval of the county assembly’ after the word regulations. I also want to amend by adding 13

(2) notwithstanding the provisions of section 13 (1) the governor my prescribe the occasion upon

which other person by whom and the manner in which the county flag may be flown, lowered or

displayed as the case may be;

(Question on amendment of clause 13 proposed)

(Question on amendment of clause 13 put and agreed upon)


Chairperson: Is there another amendment?

Hon. Kagwe: I rise to move a motion of amendment on clause 13 (1) to replace the word ‘may’

with the word ‘shall’

(Question on amendment of clause 13 (1) proposed)

(Question on amendment of clause 13 (1) put and agreed upon)

Chairperson: Do we have new clauses?


27

Hon. Kagwe: Mr. Chair I would like to introduce clause 13 (2) (a)

(Question on clause 13 (2) proposed)

Hon. Kagwe: I wish to introduce a new clause

Chairperson: You know that a new clause must be read for the second time under Standing

Order 124 (11) Mr. Chairman, can you confirm whether it is a new clause

Hon. Kagwe: Mr. Chair with consultation with the clerk we have found that it will not be

prudent to introduce a new clause. We should go to schedules

Chairperson: Shall we have any other new clauses?

Hon. Kagwe: No. I think it would be prudent that we give another member to move a new

clause

Chairperson: Hon. Kieru.

Hon. Kieru: This one needs your guidance and we have seen that other go

Chairperson: Shall we have any other new clauses?

Hon. Kagwe: No. I think it will we be prudent that we give another member to include a new

clause.


Hon. Kieru: This one needs your guidance. It is normal practice where federal governments

have the county symbols and more so they have their county or federal anthem. This one does

not have. What do we do? Now that the executive does not have the anthem and it has not put it


28

here do we as an assembly propose that they do an anthem and bring it here? I don’t have an

anthem to propose so that it can be added as a new clause. May be what we can do is to add as

new clause under the first schedule as number four we should have the county anthem. If we

write a subtitle county anthem what comes after that? Mr. Chairman guides us on this.

Chairperson: I think hon. Kieru if we put the clause that give the guidelines to the county

executive, to formulate an anthem, I think that is okay so you can move a new clause if the chair

and the committee allows and I think it has.

Hon. Kieru: Mr. Speaker I move a motion to move a new clause in the first schedule part one.

We have the county flag, the county seal, the county emblem, below the Nyandarua county

emblem and before part iv we include county anthem and call it Nyandarua county anthem. I call

upon hon. Kagwe to second.

Hon. Kagwe: I second

(Question for the second reading of clause 13 (2) proposed)

Chairperson: Members I think that it’s prudent that we have a new clause in the first schedule

that allow inclusion of county anthem.

Hon. Kieru: I am getting from you that a new clause can only be added under the category of

clauses.

Chairperson: Yes.

Hon. Kieru: Does it mean that in the schedule there can never be new clauses?

Chairperson: There can be.


29

Hon. Kieru: This means that I bring it there.

Chairperson: Therefore at this level there is no new clause. Hon. Members lets go to the

schedules. First Schedule.

Clerk: The County flag, county seal, Nyandarua county anthem.

(Question on the first schedule proposed)

(Question on the first schedule put and agreed upon)

Chairperson: At this level hon. Kieru you can put any schedule.

Hon. Kieru: Thank you Mr. Speaker, I agree with you. Under the first schedule before we go to

part IV and after the county emblem I move an amendment of creating a new clause to be

entitled Nyandarua county anthem because this is a very important part. For example we might

be having matches with the other counties which have their county anthem, we want to see that

patriotism, and we want Nyandarua team to be singing its anthem. If we don’t have we shall

watch them singing their county anthem and when it’s their turn to sing they have nothing. The

best thing to do is to have the common practice of the other federal county governments and

create our county anthem. We also need to give time lines the executive but that shall come as a

recommendation of the house that we have proposed a new clause and in the house adopts it, Mr.

chair you should give time lines on when we should have the county anthem. I call upon hon.

Kagwe to second the motion of amendment to include a new sub schedule.

Hon. Kagwe: I second.

(Question on the reading of the new schedule for the second time proposed)


30

Clerk: The Nyandarua county anthem.

(Question on the reading of the new schedule for the second time put and agreed upon)

(Question on the inclusion of the new schedule put and agreed upon)


Hon. Kieru: It’s just an oversight, if you look at the way the schedule has been arranged, and

that is why I said a sub schedule. Part one has the county flag, part two has the county seal and

part three should be the county emblem and then part four should be county anthem and then

part five will be the part five and six should be the names.

Chairperson: That is why standing order number 124 (2) accommodates all this because by the

end of the day we cannot haphazardly take this bill to the governor to assent. I understand that

the clerk has the counsel of the legal experts and the Hansard people who will sit down and look

at it before the bill is assent to by the governor. Let’s now move to part five.

Clerk: MOTTO. PAMOJA TUJIJINGE

(Question on part five proposed)

Chairperson: We have already gone through it. Let’s now move to the memorandum of reasons

and objects.


Hon. Kieru: I have an issue with the names. Let’s amend it.

Chairperson: Has the chair allowed that?


31

Hon. Kieru: Yes he has. This could be challenging, His Excellency, to refer to the governor of

the county and the deputy governor. Honorable, to refer to the county Speaker the executive

committee members and the members of the county assembly, why do we always come last? I

disagree with this. We should be the first ones. The members of the county assembly are elected.

They elect the Speaker and then the executive committee comes in. I move an amendment that

the honorable, to refer to the members of the county assembly, county Speaker and the executive

committee members.

Hon. Kagwe: I second.

Chairperson: Thank you, in fact for that it’s an oversight and we don’t even need to propose an

amendment. We know that the legislature arm of government is the first born. The executive is

the second born and the judiciary is the third born. Let’s go to clause 4.

Clerk: County symbols declared. Section 4(1) the flag of which the design and description is set

out in part one of the first schedule to this Act is hereby declared to be the county flag.

(2) The seal of which the design out in part ii of the first schedule to this Act is hereby declared

to be the public seal of the county.

(3) The emblem which out in part iii of the first schedule to this Act is hereby declared to be the

emblem of the county Assembly

Chairperson: That is a new clause and that is why I was trying to ask you whether we have a

new clause. Since it has been accommodated here and the bill is not an Act so that we can still

amend.



32

Chairperson: Move the amendment.

Hon. Kagwe: I move an amendment on clause four to add a section 5 the county anthem with

the approval of the county assembly.

Chairperson: Thank you, Mr. Chairman you should tell us the objective and the purpose of this

amendment. The standing order 124 (4) no amendment shall be permitted to be moved if the

amendment deals with a different subject or purpose to unreasonably or unduly expand the

subject of the bill, or is not appropriate or is not logical sequence to the subject matter of the bill.

I believe the initial mover of the first amendment on the county anthem was in a very good

position to tell what you informed him to have the new clause on the first schedule. Hon. Kieru.

Hon. Kieru: If you look at clause 4(4), the motto the content of which is embedded in part iv of

the first schedule of this Act is hereby declared to be the motto of the county. That one gives

authority for that motto to be a county motto. The reason why we need a county anthem is to

show the members of this county what we adore. The national flag depicts a lot, the colors and

the coat of arms. The child in class four can understand the meaning. Today we also want to

show our children what Nyandarua adore for example agriculture, unity and other things.

Last time we had the miss tourism Kenya and there was one person representing Nyandarua.

They went even in Nairobi. It was an embarrassment because some counties did their anthem and

Nyandarua and other counties didn’t. When her chance to sing the Nyandarua county anthem

came, she didn’t sing. This one shows you that we need to stamp authority as the Nyandarua

County. the chairmen and the committee agrees with the anthem and we should give directions to

the executive to give them timelines to bring the anthem because we have already created clause

five.


33

Mr. Chair you should also guide us on the names. In future the county shall have dignitaries like

Kenya has ambassadors to Uganda. May be we shall have the ambassador of Nyandarua in

Nyeri? Will they be referred to as honorable?

Chairperson: To answer you on that, any law can be amended and that one will be done that

time.

(Question on the second reading of clause 4(5) proposed)

Clerk: The county anthem is envisaged on part IV to be declared the county anthem.

(Question on the second reading of clause 4(5) proposed)

(Question in clause 4(5) put and agreed upon)

Chairperson: Now we can allow the chairman to respond to the concerns raised by hon. Kieru.

Hon. Kagwe: We know that Nyandarua County is surrounded by Aberdare ranges and the

vegetation is green. We have the falls there and it’s called the Kalulu fall which is a tourist

attraction site and the pyrethrum and the potatoes shows the agriculture produce of the county.

The elephants are steadfast no matter the challenges. The green color represents the vegetation

and the blue color represent water, white represent peace and black represent the African people.

The birds we can see represent the beauty of the land in Nyandarua County.


Hon. Kieru: Using common knowledge, a standing elephant is a weak one but not strong. It’s

known to be very strong when it stands on fours. Should the concept of strength in Nyandarua be

represented by an elephant on its fours or an elephant on its two feet? Can we really show our


34

strength using an elephant? I wish there were two potato bags that were in the place of elephants.

On the ranges we have the blue sky; the very far ranges are very dark and as you come the color

changes and the color green starts to show? We have some three white marks I don’t know

whether they are birds or clouds. The ranges are very far but what makes them dark. It means

that the sun’s ray have not emerged from the ranges. The members should explain that. Then

why do we have a very bright part at the front and a very dark part at the far end. Unless they

show an emerging sun so that where we have the cow and the sheep brightly colored. This flag

was subjected to completion. If this is the person won, were these the reason for having such a

design? Finally do we really need the name county government in our flag? I think it was only

required to be on the seal. You will never see a name on the flag of other governments. The

design of the flag itself should tell you that it belongs to Nyandarua without the name. It

becomes so predictable without any abstract meaning.

Chairperson: The chairman has been put in another quagmire. At this level, if these symbols

need to be amended it cannot be done. What we can do is after the enactment of the bill the can

be amended. I told you that any law can be amended.

Hon. Kagwe: We have the dark part of it because of the vision. This photo could have been

taken during a cloudy time. The flag is just a symbol just as we have two lions standing on our

coat of arms.

Chairperson: Let’s go to the interpretation.

Clerk: Clause 3 purpose of the Act.

In this Act, unless the context otherwise requires:-


35

“Citizen Service centers “means the citizen service centers envisaged under section 119 of the

county government Act number 17 of 2012.

“County “means Nyandarua County.

“County flags “means Nyandarua county flag specified under part one of first schedule of this

Act.

“County symbols” means county flag, emblem, seal, motto, and names specified under the first

schedule on this Act.

“Executive committee member” means the executive committee member in charge of legal and

public service.

“Governor” means the governor of Nyandarua County.

“National flag” means the national flag prescribed in the constitution of Kenya.

“Specified name” means any if the names and words specified part V of the first schedule to this

Act, and includes any abbreviation of any such name.

(Question on clause3 proposed)

(Question on clause3 put and agreed upon)

Chairperson: Let’s go to the long title of the bill.

Clerk: NYANDARUA COUNTY SYMBOLS AND NAMES PROTECTION BILL, 2014

A BILL for


36

AN ACT of county assembly of Nyandarua to provide for the use of the county and

national flag emblem, seal, motto and names, to promote cohesion in the county and by

extension national unity in the country and for connected purposes.

(Question proposed)

Hon. Kagwe: I wish to move a motion of amendment to include the word anthem between the

words “seal” and “motto”.

(Question on amendment proposed)

(Question on amendment put and agreed upon)

(Question on the long title put and agreed upon)

Clerk: Clause 2 the purpose of this Act is

a) To regulate the use of county symbols and the title of governor and other official names.

b) To provide for the use of the national flag in the county to promote national unity


(Question on clause2 put and agreed upon)

Clerk: Clause 1 this Act may be cited as the county symbols and names protection Act, 2014

and shall come into operation on such a date as the executive committee member may appoint



37

Hon. Kieru: I have a concern where we have the clause saying “on such a date as the executive

member may appoint”. I think it should have specific time lines and if it does not, the committee

member “shall” we need your guideline

Chairperson: The committee of the whole house can make an amendment we can even give a

time line of one or two months.

Hon. Kagwe: I wish to move a motion of amendment on clause (1) where we have the

executive committee member to add duration of that days from the day of assenting.

Chairperson: You are giving the executive a huge task to ensure that this is happening and I

think that is good that we look at the cost implication lets us give that at least three months.

Hon. Kagwe: The executive committee member for legal and justice has a budget and he

supposed to give a priority to some of the things since we need these symbols. Thirty days are

enough and we need these logos to be put in the bursary forms


(Question on amendment clause 1 put and agreed upon)


Hon. Kagwe: I beg to move that the committee reports to the house the considerations of the

NYANDARUA COUNTTY SYMBOLS AND NAMES PROTECTION BILL, 2014 and its

approval thereof with the amendments.

(Question on the reporting by the committee on the whole house put and agreed upon)

(The deputy Speaker takes the Speaker’s chair and hon. Rahab take the chairpersons chair)


38

Hon. Rahab: Mr. Speaker I beg to report that the committee of the whole house has considered

the NYANDARUA COUNTTY SYMBOLS AND NAMES PROTECTION BILL, 2014 and

approved the same with the amendments.

Speaker: I wish to call upon the mover.

Hon. Kagwe: I beg to move that the house do agree with the committee of the whole house

report.

(Question proposed)

(Question put and agreed upon)

Speaker: The mover.

Hon. Kagwe: I wish to thank hon. Members for debating on the report. I also wish to thank the

office of the Speaker and the office of the clerk for their support.

Speaker: Hon. Kagwe you were supposed to move that the bill be read for the third time.

Hon. Kagwe: I beg to move a motion that the NYANDARUA COUNTTY SYMBOLS AND

NAMES PROTECTION BILL, 2014 be now read for the third time.

Clerk: The NYANDARUA COUNTTY SYMBOLS AND NAMES PROTECTION BILL, 2014

(Question on the third reading of the bill put and agreed upon)

Speaker: THE NYANDARUA COUNTTY SYMBOLS AND NAMES PROTECTION BILL,

2014is ready for the assent by the governor. This house was of the opinion that the county has a

county anthem to promote unity and show cohesion and since the bill didn’t have it the house


39

added on part iv on the first schedule and also clause 4(5) to accommodate the same. Following

this development the chair makes the following direction and the executive member for legal and

justice shall ensure that

1. There is a Nyandarua county anthem.

2. The process shall be conducted competitively and public shall be involved to endure that

we get the best anthem that shall capture the aspiration of the people of Nyandarua.

3. This should be done within four month.

This communication will get to the executive through the clerk and I hope everything will be

taken there so that they can work as per the time line. Next order

Clerk: Mr. Speaker the order paper is exhausted

(House adjourns to Thursday 10th June 2014 at 2:30 pm)


Documents

assembly.nyandarua.go.keassembly.nyandarua.go.ke/download/motion/Nyandarua County... · Web viewThank you, I would like to propose an amendment on clause 5, I would like to insert