Astralaga Testimony in Laurie Fine Suit

EXHIBIT 17 to the

DECLARATION OF NATHAN E. SIEGEL IN SUPPORT OF

DEFENDANTS’ MOTION FOR SUMMARY JUDGMENT

Case 5:12-cv-00836-DEP Document 98-20 Filed 09/30/15 Page 1 of 22

1 IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

2 FOR THE NORTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK

3 Civil Action Number: 5:12-cv-00836(LEK)(DEP)

4 _____________________________________________________

5 LAURIE J. FINE,

6 Plaintiff,

7 vs.

8 ESPN, INC., MARK SCHWARZ and ARTHUR BERKO,

9 Defendants.

10 _____________________________________________________

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14 VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF DOUGLAS H. ASTRALAGA

15 AUGUST 28, 2014

16 12:56 p.m.

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VERITEXT REPORTING COMPANY212-279-9424 www.veritext.com 212-490-3430


1 IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

2 FOR THE NORTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK

3 Civil Action Number: 5:12-cv-00836(LEK)(DEP)

4 _____________________________________________________

5 LAURIE J. FINE,

6 Plaintiff,

7 vs.

8 ESPN, INC., MARK SCHWARZ and ARTHUR BERKO,

9 Defendants.

10 _____________________________________________________

11 BEFORE:

12 VIRGINIA DENESE BARRETT, Commissioner

13 LAW FIRST, by Mr. Lawrence H. Fisher, One

14 Oxford Centre, Suite 4300, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania

15 15219, appearing on behalf of the Plaintiff.

16

17 LEVINE, SULLIVAN, KOCH & SCHULZ, LLP, by

18 Mr. Nathan Siegel, 1899 L Street, NW, Suite 200,

19 Washington, DC 20036, appearing on behalf of the

20 Defendants.

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1 plaintiff.

2 MR. SIEGEL: Nathan Siegel for the

3 defendants.

4 VIDEOGRAPHER: Our court reporter, Denese

5 Barrett, representing Veritext, will now swear in the

6 witness and we can proceed.

7 DOUGLAS H. ASTRALAGA

8 The witness, having been first duly sworn or

9 affirmed to speak the truth, the whole truth, and

10 nothing but the truth, testified as follows:

11 COURT REPORTER: And will we have the usual

12 stipulations?

13 MR. SIEGEL: Yes.

14 MR. FISHER: Agreed.

15 EXAMINATION

16 BY MR. SIEGEL:

17 Q. Good afternoon.

18 A. Good afternoon.

19 Q. Why don't you state your name for the

20 record?

21 A. Douglas H. Astralaga.

22 Q. And what city do you live in?

23 A. Fairhope, Alabama.

24 Q. And what is your current job?

25 A. Chief division counsel for the FBI in

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1 Mobile.

2 Q. And where were you born?

3 A. Columbia, South America.

4 Q. And when did you come to the United

5 States?

6 A. I believe it was 1978. It was about

7 eighth grade, I think. Half a year.

8 Q. And did you come with a family?

9 A. My mother. Actually my brother, and then

10 my mother came a short time thereafter.

11 Q. How many siblings did you have?

12 A. We are five in total. I have four --

13 three brothers and a sister.

14 Q. And when you came to the United States,

15 where did you come?

16 A. Where?

17 Q. Yeah.

18 A. Syracuse.

19 Q. And how long did you live in Syracuse?

20 A. From -- let's see -- eighth grade through

21 high school. Obviously, I graduated from Henninger

22 High School. And on and off through college basically

23 Syracuse was my residence.

24 Q. Where did you live in Syracuse?

25 A. 101 Mariposa Street, Syracuse, New York.

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1 Q. And where did you go to college?

2 A. State University of New Paltz.

3 Q. And what post graduate education did you

4 have?

5 A. Juris Doctorate.

6 Q. Where did you go to law school?

7 A. Thomas Cooley Law School in Michigan.

8 Q. And do you have family here in Alabama

9 with you?

10 A. My wife and kids, yes.

11 Q. Do you know who Bernie Fine is?

12 A. Yes, I do.

13 Q. And how do you know him?

14 A. Just growing up in Syracuse and following

15 Syracuse basketball.

16 Q. Have you ever had any interaction with

17 Bernie Fine?

18 A. Yes, I did.

19 Q. Could you describe that?

20 A. I really only had one interaction with

21 him, and that was at Sunnycrest Park. I was probably

22 -- I was fifteen years old, going into eleventh grade.

23 And we used to do a lot of basketball during the

24 summer. There was a lot of games that were pretty high

25 caliber, pretty good games, and I spent most of my

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1 summer out there that year playing basketball. At

2 times some Syracuse basketball players would be at the

3 park, at the Sunnycrest Park, and, you know, it was a

4 big exciting moment for everyone to try to, you know,

5 complete with those guys. And Bernie Fine would be

6 there once in a while.

7 Q. And what interaction did you have with

8 Mr. Fine?

9 A. On one particular occasion, it was during

10 a week day. I remember that. I don't know what day it

11 was. I was on a team, and we were running the court

12 pretty well. And after we finished running the court,

13 Mr. Fine walked up to me and said that that was pretty

14 good, if I was willing to do a workout with him the

15 next day.

16 Q. And then what happened?

17 A. I said, Sure. Absolutely. And I came the

18 next day about three thirty, as I recall, and we had a

19 workout that first day.

20 Q. And what happened during the workout?

21 A. Normal workout. I'm a -- I'm 6'6" and

22 change, almost 6'7", so I play a big man position which

23 basically means I have the ball and you bounce into the

24 man and you turn and put your moves. And everything

25 seemed to be going pretty well. And Bernie asked me to

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1 come back the next day for an additional workout, and I

2 said, Sure. Absolutely. But at that point I thought

3 that was kind of weird because I felt that he lingered

4 on his defense a little bit in certain areas that I

5 didn't feel real comfortable with. But I just -- I

6 justified it in my mind saying, Well, I'm younger.

7 He's a bit older. He can't move as fast. He's not as

8 quick as I am, and that's probably the reason he was

9 kind of lingering on his defense.

10 Q. When you say lingering on his defense,

11 could you describe exactly what you mean?

12 A. Sure. Normally when you're playing in a

13 position, a guy will come behind you and they're

14 pushing off on you. They're shoving a little bit.

15 They're moving around. But it's that, you know, quick

16 in and out and you're pushing. You're using your

17 elbows and so on. He tended to kind of stay a little

18 bit longer than normal for a regular basketball player.

19 Q. Did you feel -- was he touching you when

20 he was staying on you?

21 A. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, he's touching my

22 back, my lower back, sides, things of that nature.

23 Q. Okay. Did you participate in the second

24 workout with Mr. Fine?

25 A. Yes, sir, I did.

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1 Q. What happened?

2 A. Same thing basically. We started playing,

3 and the second one, it was -- as we progressed through

4 the workout, it started getting a whole lot more.

5 There was now -- pretty much he was touching me and

6 feeling me up to a point where I felt really

7 uncomfortable. And at one point I just immediately

8 confronted him and I said, What kind of defense are you

9 playing on me, in a very rough, street-like way.

10 Q. Where was he touching you?

11 A. My back. And the thing that did it for me

12 was that he came around the back and kind of reached

13 forward. As I was trying to bounce into him, he came

14 across the front of my body a little bit.

15 Q. Did he touch any of your private parts?

16 A. He didn't get to touch my private parts.

17 He came across the side like this as I pulled away

18 inside. And that's when I confronted him and said,

19 What kind of B.S. defense are you playing on me.

20 Q. Did you feel that Mr. Fine was touching

21 you inappropriately?

22 A. Again, as a fifteen-year-old, I felt very

23 uncomfortable with the way he was playing me. I've

24 been playing basketball for a while and had never come

25 into that kind of a predicament.

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1 Q. Where did he touch you?

2 A. Oh, he was -- basically when I was moving

3 back, he had his hands on my buttocks and then he came

4 across the front. Basically he came across my front

5 only one time, while he was touching me around the back

6 side was continuous and really stayed on, which at that

7 point I was going, There's something going on here.

8 Q. What did you think was going on?

9 A. I thought he was feeling me up.

10 Q. And what exactly did you say to him?

11 A. You want me to -- I can remember still

12 what --

13 Q. Yes.

14 A. Okay. I said, What kind of fucked up

15 bullshit defense are you playing.

16 Q. And why did you use those words?

17 A. Because I -- as a kid growing up without a

18 dad, I knew that you had to be strong whenever you were

19 nervous about something and just shock them.

20 Q. And what did Mr. Fine say?

21 A. He was shocked.

22 Q. And did he respond?

23 A. Yeah. He immediately looked up at me

24 bright-eyed and put his hands up and said, No. No.

25 No. You misunderstand what I'm doing. You

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1 misunderstand what I'm doing. We've been watching you

2 for a while. You seem to be a pretty good player. And

3 he said, You know, when you finish your tenth grade,

4 we're going to be looking at you, and, you know, we're

5 going to be watching you. And at that point I looked

6 at him and I said, Now I know you're full of B.S.

7 because I'm fifteen but I'm going into eleventh grade.

8 I grabbed my basketball, and I left the park.

9 Q. And did you ever have any contact with

10 Mr. Fine again?

11 A. No, I did not.

12 Q. Why did you leave?

13 A. Because I felt that this was just one of

14 those things that -- I felt very uncomfortable with

15 Mr. Fine, and I felt that his approach and what he was

16 doing was not normal.

17 Q. Did you believe that Mr. Fine was making a

18 sexual advance on you?

19 A. I did at that time. Let me rephrase that.

20 Sexual advance, I don't know that it was a sexual

21 advance. I felt that he was feeling me up.

22 Q. Okay. And looking back on it today, do

23 you still believe that?

24 A. Yes.

25 Q. Now, you mentioned that basketball is a

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1 game where people engage in hand checking and stuff on2 defense?3 A. Yeah.4 Q. What was different about this than what5 one might call normal defensive hand checking?6 A. You -- it's an unwritten rule you don't7 just linger for no reason. And there is a physical8 aspect of basketball, obviously. This was not that.9 Like I said, I played -- I had played for a long time.10 I played for the JV team at State University of New11 Paltz as well. Been playing basketball my whole life.12 And even as a fifteen-year-old, I knew there was13 something wrong.14 Q. At that point in your life, was your15 father alive?16 A. No, he was not.17 Q. When did your father pass away?18 A. I was seven years old.19 Q. So which members of your family were you20 living with at that point?21 A. At that point it was just my oldest22 brother and my sister and my mother in Syracuse.23 Q. And do you have any other brothers?24 A. Yes, sir. I have two other brothers. My25 middle brother, his name is Ivan, and my youngest

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1 brother, his name is Andres.

2 Q. Andres. Did any of your brothers ever

3 attend the Syracuse basketball camp?

4 A. Yeah. My youngest brother, Andres, looks

5 a lot like me. Unfortunately, he didn't grow as tall

6 as I did. But he was a pretty good player, had a great

7 outside shot. And one time when I was at home, he

8 wanted to pursue it more so than most other kids. And

9 he was really serious about it. Again, he had a great

10 shot. He was doing really well. And I was home one

11 time, and he came home and said he had been at a

12 Syracuse University basketball camp.

13 Q. And what was -- did you respond to him?

14 A. Oh, I did.

15 Q. What did you say?

16 A. I said, If you ever go back over there,

17 I'm going to beat the crap out of you.

18 Q. Why did you say that?

19 A. Because I didn't feel comfortable with him

20 going over there.

21 Q. Why didn't you feel comfortable?

22 A. Because of my experience.

23 Q. With Mr. Fine?

24 A. That's correct.

25 Q. And did he ever return?

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1 A. Absolutely not. Even if he wanted, I

2 would not have allowed it.

3 Q. At some point in or around 2011, did you

4 become aware that there were news reports that ESPN was

5 broadcasting about Bernie Fine?

6 A. I can't remember if it was 2011 or 2012,

7 but I did.

8 Q. Did you have any reaction to those

9 reports?

10 A. Well, that actually came from my brother,

11 Andres.

12 Q. And can you tell us about that?

13 A. He called me and asked me about the reason

14 for our conversation when he was a young kid, and I

15 explained to him the whole thing. Maybe I need to

16 clarify the point that when Andrew came to the States,

17 at that point I believe I was a senior in high school

18 at that point in time. And he was probably fifth or

19 sixth grade. I can't remember. Maybe fourth, fifth or

20 sixth. I can't remember exactly when. So I basically

21 -- my oldest brother was already out of the house, and

22 basically I became the father figure to him

23 essentially. So everything he did, I kind of kept an

24 eye on him.

25 Q. And just so there's no confusion on the

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1 record, Andres and Andrew are the same person?2 A. Yes. Andres and Andrew.3 Q. Where did your brother Andres work in or4 around 2011?5 A. He was with ESPN.6 Q. Do you know what he did?7 A. Human resources or something.8 Q. So you mentioned that your brother called9 you about it?10 A. Yeah.11 Q. And what did you discuss?12 A. He said, Hey, do you remember that13 incident you talked to me about. I said, Yeah. I14 remember what -- you know, exactly what happened. He15 asked me what it was about, and I explained the whole16 thing to him. He said, Wow. He said, Well, I'm going17 to talk to somebody over here in my office about that.18 Q. And describe any other interaction you had19 with him or anybody else, any conversations at that20 point.21 A. I mean, to me at that point it was just he22 was inquiring about it, and I was basically done with23 that particular issue. I mean, that was it for me. I24 didn't think there was anything else to it. At some25 point -- and I can't remember in detail because I'm

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1 also the media coordinator here in this field office.

2 On or about that same time, we had issues with Auburn

3 University where there was a big shooting incident. So

4 I had media outlets reaching out to me to try to see

5 what kind of information they could obtain from the FBI

6 as it related to that particular investigation. One of

7 the media outlets was ESPN as well. So I can't

8 remember, you know, exactly when it was. But somebody

9 did reach out to me at some point about the Bernie Fine

10 issue.

11 Q. And did you have a -- do you recall what

12 they said?

13 A. No, I do not. Probably something to the

14 effect of, you know, I know your brother Andrew. He

15 explained it to us or something like that. But I don't

16 have any particular recollection of it.

17 Q. Okay. Did you ever go on the record with

18 ESPN?

19 A. I don't recall. I don't think so.

20 Q. Okay. Why?

21 A. I think at some point they wanted to run a

22 story, and basically we had -- any time an FBI agent is

23 going to talk to the media, they're not allowed to.

24 You've got to actually get clearance from either the

25 division point of contact for media matters or you

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1 reach back to headquarters through our Office of Public

2 Affairs and speak to them about it. So I reached out

3 to them to say, Hey, this is what's going on. And they

4 said, Well, it's got nothing to do with the FBI or

5 anything like that, and there's no need for you to talk

6 to them.

7 Q. Okay. So is it fair to say that your

8 superiors preferred that you not go on the record about

9 this to the media?

10 A. Yeah. And basically they asked my opinion

11 as to, you know, the basis for this conversation, and I

12 provided them the input that I felt that it was

13 unnecessary for me to get involved in anything related

14 to that at this point in time.

15 MR. SIEGEL: Okay. I have no further

16 questions but reserve the right to redirect.

17 MR. FISHER: Sure. I have a few questions.

18 EXAMINATION

19 BY MR. FISHER:

20 Q. You mentioned that you grew up in Syracuse

21 on Mariposa Street?

22 A. Yeah.

23 Q. Do you recall the proximity of Mariposa

24 Street to Wilson Street?

25 A. I know it was very near there. I can't.

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1 That's it. My wife, obviously. Yes.

2 Q. You mentioned earlier that you -- that you

3 did not want to give an interview in this case to --

4 A. Correct.

5 Q. -- ESPN; is that correct?

6 A. (Witness nodding head in the affirmative.)

7 Q. And why did you not want to give an

8 interview to ESPN?

9 A. Because I didn't want it to go out that

10 here's an FBI agent and, you know, this is an

11 individual. You know, the facts to me are the facts

12 from a fifteen-year-old kid, and that's as far as it

13 needs to go.

14 Q. Do you believe that the facts that you

15 possessed as a fifteen-year-old kid support an

16 allegation that Bernie Fine is a pedophile?

17 A. Support an allegation that he's a

18 pedophile. That's a pretty high standard. Support the

19 allegations that he's a pedophile. I really can't

20 answer that. It's a -- the legal ramifications of

21 being a pedophile versus somebody that's acting in an

22 improper way to me are quite different.

23 Q. So you see a big distinction between that?

24 A. Sure.

25 Q. And so in this case, you're only willing

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1 to go so far as you say you think he acted in an

2 improper way?

3 A. I thought he acted in a fashion with a

4 fifteen-year-old that was extremely improper. That's

5 correct.

6 Q. But he did deny any improper intent when

7 you confronted him, correct?

8 A. Yeah. Oh, yeah. He did.

9 Q. Did you speak to your brother about the

10 fact that you were going to give this deposition --

11 A. Sure.

12 Q. -- today?

13 A. Sure.

14 Q. Have you communicated with him in writing

15 about that?

16 A. No.

17 Q. What was the nature of your conversation

18 with your brother about today's deposition?

19 A. Hey. Guess what? I'm going to be deposed

20 on this thing.

21 Q. And what did he have to say?

22 A. Oh, really. That was basically it. I

23 said, Yeah.

24 Q. Okay. Do you have any reason to believe

25 that this has a bearing on his -- on his work?

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1 A. Oh, God yeah.

2 MR. FISHER: That's all the questions I have.

3 EXAMINATION

4 BY MR. SIEGEL:

5 Q. Just a couple.

6 A. Sure.

7 Q. This -- the two workouts that you

8 described with Mr. Fine, were those one on one?

9 A. Yes, they were.

10 Q. Okay. So it was just you and Mr. Fine?

11 A. Yes.

12 Q. Was there anybody else on the basketball

13 court?

14 A. Not a soul.

15 Q. To your knowledge, was there anyone else

16 watching?

17 A. Not -- basically at Sunnycrest Park things

18 wouldn't start moving until after everybody got out of

19 work, and that's when it really got really good

20 basketball is when everybody showed up. But prior to

21 that, it was pretty much empty.

22 Q. In response to Mr. Fisher's question about

23 pedophilia, you mentioned that it's a pretty high sort

24 of legal standard?

25 A. Sure.

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1 Q. What did you mean by that?

2 A. Well, I mean, there are certain advances

3 and actions in order to be a pedophile. I mean,

4 there's -- that I don't have any of those facts in

5 front of me as it relates to whether or not he is or

6 not. What I can tell you is the perception I had as a

7 fifteen-year-old kid and the perception I now have

8 sitting here as far as what he did.

9 Q. Using I guess more laymen's terms, would

10 your experience with Mr. Fine in your view support the

11 contention that he was someone who engaged in

12 inappropriate sexual advances on teenage boys at that

13 time frame in the 1980's?

14 A. As far as sexual, what I could tell you is

15 that it was to the point where I was uncomfortable

16 enough to very quickly leave, never to come in contact

17 with him ever again, making sure that that never ever

18 happened under any circumstance, whether I was going to

19 a basketball game to the point where I sternly warned

20 my brother to stay away from there.

21 Q. And where does your brother work today?

22 A. The NFL.

23 Q. So he's not currently working with ESPN?

24 A. No.

25 MR. SIEGEL: That's all I have.

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1 CERTIFICATE

2

3 STATE OF ALABAMA

4 ELMORE COUNTY

5 I hereby certify that the above and foregoing

6 deposition was taken down by me in stenotype and the

7 questions and answers thereto were transcribed by means

8 of computer-aided transcription, and that the foregoing

9 represents a true and correct transcript of the

10 testimony given by said witness upon said hearing.

11 I further certify that I am neither of

12 counsel, nor of kin to the parties to the action, nor

13 am I in anywise interested in the result of said cause.

14

15

16 Virginia Denese Barrett, CCR

17 CCR #458, Expires 9/30/2015

18 Commissioner for the

19 State of Alabama at Large

20 My Commission Expires: 9/16/2015

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Astralaga Testimony in Laurie Fine Suit